A sophisticated pirate

[bazzar]

This may be old news but anyway, has anyone seen this site?

The kid's got guts I'll give him that....

[N2056]

Somehow I think sophisticated is not the best description.
"Stupid" comes to mind...closely followed by "Moron", "Idiot", "Dumb*@&!"....it goes downhill from there :d

[MCDesigns]

Somehow I think sophisticated is not the best description.
"Stupid" comes to mind...closely followed by "Moron", "Idiot", "Dumb*@&!"....it goes downhill from there :d

Agreed and the sad thing is, his parents are doing a really poor job at pretending to be parents. Another reason to keep your kids off the internet unless supervised.

[OleBoy]

What the hell? 13 years old and he has a website for pirated software?? Where are the parents!!

[OleBoy]

Come to think of it, the parents are likely meth heads, tweakers, drunks...or the likes

[Lateral-G]

What the hell? 13 years old and he has a website for pirated software?? Where are the parents!!

My guess is the parents have no clue. Not many parents are internet savvy and have no clue what a bit or a byte is much less a torrent download.

The kid has his PC in his room, an internet connection and is smart and tech savvy. His parents are probably thrilled he's not out doing drugs or going goth. He's quiet, on the PC and staying out of trouble (at least as far as they can see).

They wouldn't have a clue what he's up to (and as long as they don't see internet porn probably don't care).

He could also be in a single parent home and that parent may not be around a whole lot to supervise his internet activities.

I'm not aplogizing for the kid or what he's done. In his mind (most likely) he thinks it's OK. He's of the generation that thinks file sharing is fine. All his friends do it and it's all he's known since he's been online. What he needs is someone to explain to him why it's wrong.

-G-

[OleBoy]

Point taken. And, after my response, I remembered the day my son was burning cd's. My new CD's were used by him to burn music. Initailly I thought..ok, whats a few cd's? Later that day he was still at the PC burning disks. I was suspicious, and asked where he got all the music. He said, a friend let him borrow his music. I thought....hmmm. Then I asked where his friend got the music. My son told me that he downloaded it off the internet. My son was 13 mind you.

Anyway...I got his friends phone number and called. Spoke to his mother and explained what was going on. I told here that my son had about 80 cd's of music he borrowed from her son. She replied...my son doesn't have but maybe 15 cd's. That's when I told her what my son told me...that he was dowloading it off the net and giving it to his friends.

To end the story, my sons..friends mother was livid. And I the same. As a result my son lost that friendship due to my actions. My son now realizes it's flat out stealing.

[spotlope]

What the site address? I think we need to school this young 'un about what happens when you promote piracy.

[idancesafetydance]

I was hoping this was updates or paint for the "Pirat"....

[bazzar]

What the site address? I think we need to school this young 'un about what happens when you promote piracy.

Bill send me a PM mate and I'll give you the addy. I'd rather not have this one out in the public domain. He has torrent downloads for everything from Aerosoft through to Wilco. I think he is just assembling the links from pirate sites but what i find faintly amusing is where he can't obviously find a torrent download link he actually shows the price of the product and manufacturers download info!

[djscoo]

What an idiot... I'm sure blogspot won't approve of their site being used for illegal software piracy. Attempting to report it as I type.


Please note that we can only process DMCA complaints originating from the copyright ownerIt's a maze of links and forms to file a complaint.:kilroy:

[SirBenn21]

I was hoping this was updates or paint for the "Pirat"....

Me Too. :isadizzy:

[GrinningJester]

Heh, or his parents are pirates themselves (perhaps not FS X software, but music, games, movies), like millions of other people?

Yes, piracy sucks for us developers. We loose money, but if you're crying that the parents are methheads or ignorant in some way, then I'm afraid you're the one 'behind the times'.

Downloading copyrighted material these days is an inevitable result of higher internet speeds and connectivity. I will say it again and again; you can not stop it- not through laws nor through punishing the users.

The torrent seeders are only a miniscule part of the grand scheme. Hell, copyrighted files are hosted on Usenet servers, which consist mainly of ISP backbones. So how do you stop all seeding if you're going to have to shut down many massive ISP backbones?

No reason to get fired up. It's a normal thing in todays society. Best thing one can do is mellow out, and value those customers that DID purchase your product, and make their experience as enjoyable as possible. They are, after all, why we payware devs are still here.

My 2c.

[Nick C]

Can you check your PM's when you're next around Baz, I'd like to pass on the URL to Aerosoft.

[falcon409]

My guess is the parents have no clue. Not many parents are internet savvy and have no clue what a bit or a byte is much less a torrent download.

The kid has his PC in his room, an internet connection and is smart and tech savvy. His parents are probably thrilled he's not out doing drugs or going goth. He's quiet, on the PC and staying out of trouble (at least as far as they can see).

They wouldn't have a clue what he's up to (and as long as they don't see internet porn probably don't care).

He could also be in a single parent home and that parent may not be around a whole lot to supervise his internet activities.

I'm not aplogizing for the kid or what he's done. In his mind (most likely) he thinks it's OK. He's of the generation that thinks file sharing is fine. All his friends do it and it's all he's known since he's been online. What he needs is someone to explain to him why it's wrong.
-G-
I would have to say you are spot on in your assessment "G". Also, what goes hand in hand with being that young is a distinct air of invincibility. The mantra of the young, I'm too smart to get caught, lol.

If he truly is clueless as to how much trouble he can get into pulling a stunt like this, maybe a simple "eye-opening" chat can fix it, but if he's hyped this little escapade to his friends. . .the pressure to maintain will be greater than the possibility that he "might" get caught.

[Dougie]

I'm not aplogizing for the kid or what he's done. In his mind (most likely) he thinks it's OK. He's of the generation that thinks file sharing is fine. All his friends do it and it's all he's known since he's been online. What he needs is someone to explain to him why it's wrong.So be sympathetic to the kid...get in contact with him if there are any details...post on the blog....whatever. Just explain and help him to understand. And get the site pulled!

Dougie

[Henry]

My view for what its worth
i do not believe he knows what he is doing
and his parents just the same
look what i got off the internet today, even if it went that far
im not condoning and it needs to stop
but he got an airplane off the internet
so what! [His parents view not mine]
or he's smart he has a web site
just looking at it from the other side.
Bottom line here in my opinion
its the hosts that should take responsibility
they do or should know better
to me there lies the problem
H

[Bjoern]

Heh, or his parents are pirates themselves (perhaps not FS X software, but music, games, movies), like millions of other people?

Yes, piracy sucks for us developers. We loose money, but if you're crying that the parents are methheads or ignorant in some way, then I'm afraid you're the one 'behind the times'.

Downloading copyrighted material these days is an inevitable result of higher internet speeds and connectivity. I will say it again and again; you can not stop it- not through laws nor through punishing the users.

The torrent seeders are only a miniscule part of the grand scheme. Hell, copyrighted files are hosted on Usenet servers, which consist mainly of ISP backbones. So how do you stop all seeding if you're going to have to shut down many massive ISP backbones?

No reason to get fired up. It's a normal thing in todays society. Best thing one can do is mellow out, and value those customers that DID purchase your product, and make their experience as enjoyable as possible. They are, after all, why we payware devs are still here.

My 2c.

This post, lads and lassies, deserves to be stickied and framed in gold or platinum!

The best damn statement I've read about the subject in a loooong time.

Jester, you're signed up for a free beer, should we ever meet outside the internet. :ernae:

[bazzar]

The point here is that this kid needn't do this. He is publishing torrent addresses alongside manufacturers' links with the bonefide price. Why would you do that? It's just a review site.

I'm afraid that this is just another symptom of some of the progeny of gen "X"and gen "Y" putting into practice what their parents taught them...apathy.

This just does one thing, builds a distinct lack of basic values and worse still, disrespect for those talented, honest people who do this work. If we had "chilled" when we were creating the computer (yes, us old farts brought you that) and not worried about piracy of ideas, you probably would not be enjoying the technology you have on your desk right now.

As a developer I don't actually care about "pirates" and have expressed my views on this before but I do fear for a planet, the care of which will inevitably fall into these people's hands. That's a much bigger issue.:engel016:

[scott967b]

Found what looks like the site as a blog from google, but only in the cached. Trying to get the site gives "blog not found". Gee I wonder what happened :) I wanted to click on his "How's my site working out?" button.

scott s.
.

[Blue/Angel/Fan]

I agree with GrinningJester (http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/member.php?u=82095) about the just chill and lay back, Piracy can't be stopped and thanking the costumers that did buy the product. Back when i was beginning life on my own and in debt i used to pirate a whole lot. I didn't have the money to buy add-ons but i sure did want some of the cool stuff that was on the market, That's most of what this kids doing. But most of the people pirating are kids who won't get money from there parents, As most developers think that there losing a lot of money there actually not losing that much of the potential costumers, But i still don't approve of what this kids doing. The second reason this kids doing it is because at age 13 at home, at school, and on the internet what does every kid want... To be cool by sharing this he just thinks he's gonna be accepted and cool to whoever is on his site, He will sooner or later learn that people don't care whos giving it as long as they can get it. So I'm just saying sit back and watch it all crumble.

[N2056]

So I'm just saying sit back and watch it all crumble.

And crumble it will with an attitude like that in the younger generation!

[Blue/Angel/Fan]

And crumble it will with an attitude like that in the younger generation!

And what? You think we should go do something. We can't really do much. I mean probably the only thing we can do is try to get his ISP to close off his internet which will be back up within a matter of weeks or even days...

I've never been a big fan of the age card, I never did understand why people used age as an excuse for so many things even on some people they don't even know the people they use it on.

[djscoo]

I'm on the fence...if people want to pirate software, they're going to do it. I feel like it's a waste of time to make it the sole purpose of ones life to stop piracy. The current ways of preventing piracy are grossly inefficient and ineffective. By implementing anti-piracy software, you are simply delaying the inevitable, and in many cases the paying customer is hurt.

Bottom line is this kid is an idiot, and I feel like it was worthwhile to get the blog taken down. It took all of 5 mouse clicks and a bit of typing to report it, and now it's down.:running:

[huub vink]

Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

I think we all make photocopies from books, which had a statement included that we should have asked the copyright owner first. Didn't we all record music on casette tapes from the radio to listen to in the car. Or for the younger generation is all the music on your MP3 player fully legal?

Are all those recordable CDs and DVDs really just made to back-up data?

Okay, I confess I made illegal copies from books during my study and still sometimes do for my work. And I also recorded music from the radio and I still sometimes listen to music on "You tube", from which I'm not sure whether it is uploaded there legally.

Therefore I admit; I'm a fool like the kid who made this site.......

Huub

[Z-PurpleBubble]

Agreed and the sad thing is, his parents are doing a really poor job at pretending to be parents. Another reason to keep your kids off the internet unless supervised.

Do you really think that modern day parents have enough free time on their hands to do that?

I would rather say that his parents are doing a pretty good job at being parents because the kid is bright enough to have his own website, he stays off the street and away from drugs and gangs and so forth. Also the kid SHARES.

Posting torrent links is but a minor thing. Nothing worth capital punishment. Or is that what you had in mind for either parents or the kid?

[Z-PurpleBubble]

Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

I think we all make photocopies from books, which had a statement included that we should have asked the copyright owner first. Didn't we all record music on casette tapes from the radio to listen to in the car. Or for the younger generation is all the music on your MP3 player fully legal?

Are all those recordable CDs and DVDs really just made to back-up data?

Okay, I confess I made illegal copies from books during my study and still sometimes do for my work. And I also recorded music from the radio and I still sometimes listen to music on "You tube", from which I'm not sure whether it is uploaded there legally.

Therefore I admit; I'm a fool like the kid who made this site.......

Huub

So right Huub "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone".

hatt's off to ya!!

[cheezyflier]

Do you really think that modern day parents have enough free time on their hands to do that?



yes they do, or they shouldn't be parents. my kids never use the internet in this house unsupervised, except on the RARE occasion when my wife leaves the computer on and no one is home for an hour. (at most)
we have a password that the kids don't know. they can't start it without us.
otherwise they each get 1 hour/day or 1.5 hrs if they do their homework immediately after coming home from school. their internet time comes after dinner, not before. it's not that hard to do. it's just basic parenting. now, what they do at their fathers house, that's out of our jurisdiction.

[bazzar]

yes they do, or they shouldn't be parents. my kids never use the internet in this house unsupervised, except on the RARE occasion when my wife leaves the computer on and no one is home for an hour. (at most)
we have a password that the kids don't know. they can't start it without us.
otherwise they each get 1 hour/day or 1.5 hrs if they do their homework immediately after coming home from school. their internet time comes after dinner, not before. it's not that hard to do. it's just basic parenting. now, what they do at their fathers house, that's out of our jurisdiction.



There you go, it isn't hard and it isn't time consuming. It's just plain common sense. My son is now part of my business and believe me if he didn't have a sense of values or "corectness" I'd be out of business.
Why then is it OK for others to behave that way?

Here's a scenario, what if all developers just stole everybody else's code, reverse engineered stuff etc. The customers would soon be questioning ethics, why all models seemed to be the same etc. Is that what people want?

[djscoo]

Here's a scenario, what if all developers just stole everybody else's code, reverse engineered stuff etc. The customers would soon be questioning ethics, why all models seemed to be the same etc. Is that what people want?

???...your logic is questionable...

[bazzar]

How exactly?

[Bjoern]

Here's a scenario, what if all developers just stole everybody else's code, reverse engineered stuff etc. The customers would soon be questioning ethics, why all models seemed to be the same etc. Is that what people want?

In case of freeware, I couldn't care less as long as everyone involved is properly credited.
As for payware, well...kind of a fraud, eh?

[Gibbage]

Piracy is bad, mkay?

Simply put, its way too easy today. Im from the DOS era, and it was not hard. Just copy that floppy. But you limit the distribution to just a few friends. 4-5 copies at most. Even when the internet first started, you had a few rare pirate pages, and newsgroups. Both of them came with risk's and needing special software and knowledge on how to use them. It was still back room and limited to the people who really wanted to pirate. The people you would never get money from anyways.

Today its a different story. Pirate Bay is splashed across the headlines every other week, and Torrents are simply easy. You need zero knowledge to find and use them, and you redistribute it to thousands of people, not a select few. So now every day people (who would of purchased the product) can pirate it and save a little money. Inversely, companies who put in any anti-piracy measures are seen as the bad guy because it only seems to effects people who properly purchased the software. This also tends to drive more people into downloading the torrent.

Overall, piracy is bad, no matter how you try and justify it. Threads like this only shows people how easy it is.

[IanP]

I started out playing games well before the DOS era, when you simply threw a tape into your parents' (or your own) stereo or linked your two tape decks together and hey presto, you had a perfect copy.

You have, however, hit two of the nails directly on the head. It's not too easy to copy things now, but it is vastly too easy to distribute them and there's no comeback against the uploaders, who are the root of the problem. Likewise, the companies that actually do try and protect their products end up annoying the very people who keep them in business at all when they make the protection too overzealous or it pushes the price and timescales of projects out the window.

The big problem is that certain developers just decided, when I wrote the last paragraph, that I am, simply must be, a massive pirate who uses massive amounts of illegal software. Simply because I say that the current situation doesn't work. I've already said my piece about the only way it's going to get solved and, as predicted, I got shouted down by the "it can't be done!!" crowd. Right now, though, there's no good coming out of the situation at all for developers, they lose whatever they do.

[Gibbage]

The first thing pirates do, is rip out the copy protection. So people who download the pirated version dont have the copy protection to deal with. Does this mean that the copy protection's dont work? No. Not at all. It just keeps people who legitimately buys it from giving it to a friend. It stops what we call casual pirates. It wont stop torrents and skilled hackers who can rip out almost any projection.

Its a fine line, between protecting our investment, and intruding on our customers. Some say having no protection gives more sales. Some argue not having protection just makes it easier for the pirates and casual pirates, and you loose more sales. I dont know. I dont have the numbers. The people who have run the numbers like EA, Valve, and such clearly show that they believe having copy protection is worth it.

The only games that I have ever seen that are truly copy protected are MMO's and games using online distribution like Steam. I have yet to see a pirated copy of World of Warcraft. But this is not an option for FSX. There are other recent games like Red Faction that use MS Live. You need to use a CD key and register on Live to save your game. Ya you can pirate it, but you cant play online or save your game. Then pirates are only sharing out a massive demo =) But again, it detours customers. Its always going to be a fine line. There is no true solution to satisfy everyone, but if we dont do something, we will go broke, and everyone has less 3rd party options.

[IanP]

I agree almost entirely with that post - I happen to agree that at least simple copy protection to limit "casual" copying is an absolute necessity - it's an unfortunate truth that even many normally honest people need reminding that they shouldn't be doing something illegal. Clearly it's untrue that having no copy protection means copyright doesn't apply, but there seem to be a lot of people who believe it is the case.

It's interesting that EA, however, dropped copy protection down to a simple serial code and CD requirement on Sims3, after major customer backlash from their recent attempts to prevent copying of their software. I read a report in the press (possibly the BBC technology section? I may be wrong on that) that "experts" now believe the Sims3 is the most copied single piece of software in history - yet EA haven't (yet) done what was expected and announced that they're putting even more draconian protection on in the future as a response.

In the end, though, societal laws work on a principle of punishment for breaking the rules. Punishing downloaders in a meaningful way is utterly impractical. There are so many of them it would cost far too much both in monetary terms and the effect it would have on the economy. Therefore you have to find a way of effectively punishing those who actually do the distribution. No single developer or even a small group can do that yet no-one seems capable of pulling together enough strands to create a rope which you can use to hang the *%$£@#s responsible for the current situation.

[Bjoern]

The people who have run the numbers like EA, Valve, and such clearly show that they believe having copy protection is worth it.

Side note:
EA and other companies are reverting back to the old school DVD check and CD key for their newest releases.

At the moment, the trend is basically: Copy protection yes, but not too sophisticated.

Should be good news for everyone, yet upon reading that Call Of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 is going to cost 60€s upon release (10€s more than the average game on release day), I get the impression that the publishers *want* people to pirate their stuff for whatever reason. :kilroy:



The only games that I have ever seen that are truly copy protected are MMO's and games using online distribution like Steam.

Plus games like Joint Operations or BF2 which require a valid key in order to play them on internet servers.

[IanP]

I'd also like to add that although many people like playing games online, there are still massive numbers who don't play games against other humans at all. They don't care whether they need a code to play online or not.

[CBris]

I love these pointless arguments :D

I can throw stones - well, small ones. My tape recorders always cost that bit more for the recording industry's "take", so I paid for the right to use the tape deck to make music compilations for my own use. But the music industry is different anyway... Besides, why "steal" music anyway? If it is good, it will be played on the radio or internet often enough anyway. There's so many "legal" broadcasters out there, that you can hear your favourite songs on public playlists a lot of the time.

...and recording from public broadcasting for personal use is allowed.

As for software. I have, on one occasion, reformatted my main hard discs so that I was unexpectedly able to use a "free trial" twice. I bought that software in the end anyway - as I had planned to all along.

Personally, I have never felt the need for more wrong ownership than that. If I can't afford the item, I simply don't buy it. But it is not the hackers and crackers who are totally at fault - it is US - the generations that spawned them. This total lack of respect in some people today is simply because there is a big gaping hole on their upbringing.

So next time you see "inconsiderate behaviour" feel a spot of pity for someone who is less blessed with morals than yourself. And then go say sorry to your own kids and grandkids...

By the way - if you are one of those who thinks wrongdoing is cool, I just hope you never have to come home to find your house empty and vandalised, or your wallet missing, or your car not where you parked it.

Oh... and have you taken your daily pinch of salt yet?

[N2056]

This, among many other factors, has pretty much killed my desire/ability to do this for profit. :frown:
At some point the BS factor becomes more than this is worth. In some ways I am happy, as I can now model whatever I want the way I want, and don't expect anything fast.
My hero is Piglet :ernae:

[IanP]

The law actually states that you can only retain things recorded off the air - television or video - for a short period of time, Chris. It is actually illegal to retain it indefinitely but, as with punishing downloaders, everyone knows it is unenforceable so most people will happily keep everything for as long as they like.

There is, however' still a massive divide between the past and present regarding not the difficulty of copying but, as I said before, the ease of distribution. Copying something onto a tape for a friend creates one copy. It costs you time and money to tape something while peer-to-peer systems can distribute thousands of copies simultaneosly. The past and present are not particularly comparable in terms of the effect copying has on sales.

[huub vink]

I love these pointless arguments :D

So do I Chris :D

However I'm not trying to say piracy isn't a crime, but I'm just trying to make people aware that we all make mistakes. Personally I think the problem is far too complex to blame just the parents.

I guess we humans are just not ready for internet .

Cheers,
Huub ;)