I would like to pilot Rotorcraft but....

[maguireted]

I would like to pilot helicopters but I always crash and I do not move! To learn about planes ,FSX is good but It is very poor about helicopters .Can you help me to find a site or advise me books about these machines .Thank you , Regards Anna

[cajj1]

http://www.hovercontrol.com/ is the best site for flight sim helicopter related stuff.

I too am useless at flying helis but I found it much easier once I got a joystick with a twist function. I also found that flying the FSX helicopter tutorial missions helped a lot.

Jim

[CBris]

Yes indeed - at Hovercontrol you can even get "live" instruction if I remember right. They teach their members well; you get structured lessons and you even have tests to get your virtual pilot's license. If anyone can help, they can.

But be aware that you'll need patience.

Flying a helicopter is like sitting on a big ball, balancing a plate on your head - with a glass marble in it - and holding a house-brick in each hand.

Good luck, you may end up enjoying the experience.

[maguireted]

thank you, it's kind of you ! I realize that it is quite difficult but I am a person with great determination .So, perhaps I will succeed . Thank you very much , Best Regards , Yours Anna

[Brett_Henderson]

Obviously, you need to have yaw control.. but a twisting joystick is not the answer. It will work but is much more dificult than it needs to be.

The control inputs for helicopters are complex and subtle.. It's nearly impossible to maintain constantly changing, precise cyclic-control.. AND make the needed yaw inputs with the same hand.. sometimes they'll go from left to right.. try making a smooth transition from one side to the other (and back again, without over-controling) with the twisting part of the joystick, while trying to modulate pitch and bank, too :isadizzy:

Sure.. it can be done.. but if you ever hope to control a sim-copter, as accurately and realistically as a sim-plane.. you need rudder pedals.

[kilo delta]

Also......try lowering the Flight model realism settings until you become more proficient at flying the heli's. Having yaw control/rudder pedals would be a major advantage too.:)

[CodyValkyrie]

Most developers who post realism settings for helicoptors generally have settings around medium. FS does not model helos extremely well, but some modelers have made up for some of its issues. Nemeth Designs produces excellent content, and I can also heartily recommend the Aerosoft Jayhawk Seahawk package. In the latter, the dynamics are fairly docile for a helo. You might have good luck with it.

Regardless, learnint to fly a helo is all about patience as suggested. I have no doubt however you can do it.

And here is a tip when attempting to hover that helps me immensely. Don't focus on close objects, but if you can see the horizon focus on it. This gives you great depth and situational awareness, and also helps you see where very small movements are necessary. As you become more experienced, you can shift your attention elsewhere.

Having a yawing device does indeed help, but I would personally recommend rudder pedals. They have a great range of motion which is more suitable for minute adjustements. With a swivel joystick, it is easy to accidentally overcorrect. However, I did fly helos for 2 years with just a swivel stick....

Lastly, having a TrackIR REALLY helps the simming experience, especially in helos. Having the ability to freely look around is critical in a helo and gives a great sense of awareness and heightened response.

[Tako_Kichi]

Proper rudder pedals for FS9/X are expensive items but if someone in your family has a USB steering wheel and pedals for car racing games you CAN use the pedals in FS9/X too. That's what I use (until I can afford a proper set) and they do work but nowhere near as good a true rudder pedals.

By using the racing wheel pedals the 'twisty' rudder on my X52 now activates the left/right brakes giving me differential braking which is another bonus.

[gajit]

Women make great real world chopper pilots due to their light, gentle touch - I bet you wlll be hovering in no time!!

[chinookmark]

A few things I have found to make helicopters easier:

1) A stick with no center detents, since you will be making very small corrections around center. The MS Force Feedback 2 was great for this. Now I use a Saitek X52 Pro, but I have zip ties on the spring so the centering plate just slides around. (This makes it impossible to trim a fixed wing, though. :d)

2) A decent rudder control. The FFBk2 had a light twist grip, and worked pretty well. The twist grip on the X52 is way too stiff, and makes small smooth corrections very difficult. A friend of mine uses a Thrustmaster Afterburner HOTAS, and the rocker on the throttle isn't too bad. I ordered Saitek rudder pedals yesterday, so I will have to get back to you on that.

3) Collective. The throttle lever on the FFBk2 was a little small to be precise. The throttle on the X52 (detents removed) works great. It's even more realistic if you strap the throttle to the side of your chair and reverse the throttle axis in the sim, so you are pulling up to go up.

4) Situational awareness. You can't get a good feel for movement by lookng straight ahead, especially if you are more than a few feet off the ground. TrackIR has made a world of difference -- I can't even begin to describe. If you don't want to spend the money, there is also Free Track: http://www.free-track.net/english/ And don't forget to watch your instruments. I find the VSI and airspeed indicator to be by far the most important instruments in the heli.

5) Practice. (Of course.)

6) Go nuts. In real helicopters (and radio control) you need to be able to hover before you can fly. As simmers, we don't have that restriction. Years ago, I learned how to fly by grabbing a handful of collective and yanking and banking (hey, I was a kid!) At higher speeds, the helicopter flies a little more like an airplane, so the control movements will feel more familiar to you. If you can maintain level flight and smooth turns will full collective, well you're that much closer to being able to control a heli. So if you get frustrated trying to hover, take a little break and burn up the sky for a bit.

Hope this helps. Good luck!

[MCDesigns]

Cody, the aerosoft helis have a joke of an airfile, very dumbed down for casual users. My biggest complaint with an otherwise great addon.

Anna, I fly rotary about 70-80% of the time and find the FSX helis to be a little too easy compared to the FS9 ones. I suggest checking the settings on your joystick and reduce your NULL settings to zero. Then set your aircraft realism to EASY. Then use the default bell 206 and practice, practice, practice. Once you feel you are getting the hang of it, turn your realism up a notch, but never go to full as helicopters behave badly in the sim at full realism.

Hope that helps

[fliger747]

Each seems to have their own experience with this. Mine, well I fly with all sliders to the right. Indeed the FSX choppers are harder to fly than the FSX ones. That I can fly the FSX choppers reasonably well as a 20,000 hr pilot who has worked with the sim choppers for a long time possibly makes it hard for me to evaluate this for most users. I do not think the FSX choppers are either too easy or two hard. There even exists an addon that makes it even more sensitive, though not in an unrealistic manner. It does help facilitate some manuvers such as backwards flight.

T.

[fliger747]

Chatting with one of my buddies who has flown both sim and real choppers extensively, says that the sim is a little more difficult.

The main thing he said, which jives with my experience, is thta after a certian point, the 'light bulb' finally comes on. A lot of frustrating practice is necessary to achive this point. it will come!

T.

[Brett_Henderson]

My cousin flew helos for a sheriff's department.. The few hours I spent with him online (multi-player shared-cockpit), did wonders.

It's kind of like flying fixed wing planes in the sim. If you approach it realistically.. learn the fundementals, and build from there, it all falls into place. If you're one of those people who just "joysticks" their way around the sky.. you can get away with that with the fixed wing stuff.. but not the helos..

[CodyValkyrie]

Cody, the aerosoft helis have a joke of an airfile, very dumbed down for casual users. My biggest complaint with an otherwise great addon.

The Aerosoft Jayhawk isn't perfect, but I'll take it any day compared to the default Bell 206 or the Alphasim Blackhawk. From what I hear at Aerosoft, a few real Jayhawk pilots gave the green light on how it flies. Not necessarily defending it, but these are the things that I have heard contradicting what you say.

Another nice thing about the Aerosoft Jayhawk package... semi working auto hover system. Not perfect, but a valient attempt.

Anyways, I like it. I'm interested however more in why you don't...

[fliger747]

I agree that the MSFF2 was about the best fro choppers. I have used in combination with CH rudders and the Saitek X-45 throttle. The X52 and X45 work pretty well, as mentioned, with some tye wraps arond the spring toreduce it's force. Mine still lightly centers, so is OK for heli's or fixed wing, though one then always has to hold the stick as the centering force, even though light will cause issues.

T.

[Marvin Carter]

Practice,Practice,Practice!!!

Marvin Carter

[gajit]

Chatting with one of my buddies who has flown both sim and real choppers extensively, says that the sim is a little more difficult.


T.

I agree with your buddy - the sim is much much harder. Anyone who can get to grips with FSX choppers would excell in the real thing. I know 2 commercial H pilots who will not bother with FS9 or FSX as they find it too frustrating!!

[Gizmokev]

the difference between a real helo and sim helos I have found is the referencing when low and slow. You have to maintain small inputs in both so try not to overcompensate or you will end up with Pilot Induced Oscillations and just crash. SO keep you inputs small even if they dont take effect straight away dont go full left to full right.

In the real thing I always used to take off without any centring action and then set the trim once established in a hover (Gazelle HT2) so taking off the centring action with cable ties is a good idea.

The hardest thing to get used to in a helo is that although all inputs are directly related to each other (as they are in a fixed wing) they are more so in a helo but to maintain level flight as well as turns you will sometimes find yourself with crossed inputs. By that I mean lever fully down in a right hand turn reducing speed with left yaw on....it sounds really weird but it happens.

The only thing to do is to practise with the realism settings reduced and increase them as you get better. I have messed about with a few helos and found them to be very good but nothing like the real thing. I am sure a TrackIR would benefit helo flying as you are always searching for references when flying the real thing and you head is constantly moving about to check them which is difficult in the sim.

[maguireted]

Thank you to you all and wholeheartedly ! Herr MC Designs thank you for settings .It is better like this . I hardly fly! Now , I hope to be able to fly add-on helicopters . As Herr Marvin Carter said , always Practice ! Best Regards , Anna

[maguireted]

Herr Chinookmark , Yours Suggestions have been copied and pasted into a folder .
It is wonderful . Best Regards Anna