M$ flight simulator

[greenie]

WOW ....who's not going to try this - fselite.net

[falcon409]

WOW ....who's not going to try this - fselite.net
I would guess quite a few, however there are many who will also be looking at how "cross-over" friendly it will be and ultimately. . .what kind of rig will it require to actually see what we are given as previews. It's for certain the videos and screens we are shown were not run on the average system.

It looks amazing but if my native FSX addons (scenery and aircraft) won't make the jump or my current system (which runs FSX/Accel and P3D_V4.4) doesn't give me something that impresses me enough to stay. . .then I'll stay with what I have and I would imagine many others will be in the same boat. . .at least initially.

[Dangerous Beans]

I will definatly try it but staying with it dedends on there pricing. If they go with a subsription model for the top tier scenery then they can stick it.

Backward compatability would be nice but they will have to drop it at some point just so the tech can move forward. The old FS engine is so old now that it has to be holding things back to some extent.

[gastonj]

Hi,

FSX has on old engine, but that concerns flight model, i suppose. 3D models could be easily moved at the price of some changes in texturing and animations.

JM

[Penzoil3]

Have you seen this?
Froogle changed his mind... me too.

https://youtu.be/Fj8h6yibHHc

[dvj]

You could call the new MS Flight Simulator a disruptor. I will not buy any more scenery or payware aircraft for my current FSX. Now it's a wait and see.

-d

[greenie]

Good video by Froogle.

I have been waiting for more information about this sim and P3dV5 before I build my new computer, to get VR'd. Will I be interested in p3d after this ?
maybe because it doesn't support VR.

[navy81]

This is a very in-depth look and discussion by AIRBOYD who attended the event and flew the pre-alpha product.
It is a bit long at 34 minutes, but provides a wealth of info on the product and future plans.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkMoZkGhIog

Cheers.
Deke

[Boss86001]

You could call the new MS Flight Simulator a disruptor. I will not buy any more scenery or payware aircraft for my current FSX. Now it's a wait and see.

-d I also am not buying any more payware for P3d or XPL11.

[Dangerousdave26]

It also is going to put some developers out of their niche because the MS Flight Simulator flaws will be gone. No longer will there need to be teams that develop realistic terrain and weather. Scenery designers might also take a hit on some level that one will really depend on how accurate the autogen is.

I am looking forward to it but will probably need a newer PC.

[n4gix]

It also is going to put some developers out of their niche because the MS Flight

Based on the many comments I've been reading since the E3 announcement of the rebirth of MSFS, I've come to one rather disturbing conclusion...

By the time that MSFS is released from final beta, the talent pool of aircraft modelers and gauge/systems programmers will be nearly non-existent. Slow or no sales of new aircraft means no way to pay the employees, who will be forced to update their resumes and seek out job opportunities.

I've spent the past two decades learning and polishing my crafts. It will take years before new product for MSFS from third parties to become available.

[ceo1944]

Based on the many comments I've been reading since the E3 announcement of the rebirth of MSFS, I've come to one rather disturbing conclusion...

By the time that MSFS is released from final beta, the talent pool of aircraft modelers and gauge/systems programmers will be nearly non-existent. Slow or no sales of new aircraft means no way to pay the employees, who will be forced to update their resumes and seek out job opportunities.

I've spent the past two decades learning and polishing my crafts. It will take years before new product for MSFS from third parties to become available.

I'm seeing what you're seeing Bill. Sales of everything are dropping rapidly as people wait for the new sim. Many companies will not survive the gap between now and release, not even to mention the gap between the release and the time it will take to re-engineer add-ons for the new interfaces. As you well know simply converting sophisticated systems code from FSX to Prepar3D is far from trivial and those two are based on ESP. We'll have to wait and see but I highly doubt such a new sim rebuilt with a new engine will be 100% compatible with FSX. I rather suspect it will be dramatically different internally and require massive work to adapt add-ons.

Looking back we can see that the stability brought about by the long life of FSX and its direct descendants made the add-on development industry what it is now; and if we don't see that dismantled over the next year it'll be a miracle.

This also impacts not just the FSX/P3D world but I see major side effects on other platforms also.

Sadly,
Dutch

Also a Milviz Developer

[tommieboy]

WOW ....who's not going to try this - fselite.net

Me for one.

FSX Steam is simply the end of the line for me. Not enough time or money to invest any further in this hobby, including Windows 10. I did not expect the on-going costs of upgrading to new cell phones and tablets every few years (for a family of four) to be what they are. That alone blows my computer budget out of the water. It's not all bad news though as FSX Steam, along with my newish graphics card and Steve's FSX DX10 Scenery Fixer and Cloud Shadows, added new life to my old rig. So I'll keep my current FSX Steam install until Microsoft pulls the plug on Windows 7 or FSX Steam. Once that is done, the stand alone computer system will be a thing of the distant past for this family. Hopefully this old rig finds it way to computer heaven (landfill in India) where my old Intel 8086 Leading Edge Model D now lives. :sorrow:

Tommy

[stansdds]

I'll be continuing with FSX until some time after MSFS is released. Once MSFS has been on the market long enough for 3rd party support to be abundant, the bugs have been addressed, there is reasonably accurate AI aircraft operations, and ATC at least as good as (hopefully better than) FSX, then it will be time to move on. M$ has made it clear that Windows X is the only operating system of the future. I think they are looking at MSFS as the flight sim of the future and it will operate only on Windows X. I do think we will see FSX relegated to the scrap heap of software, diehards will continue with it, but the third party support will evaporate.

[b52bob]

I am also awaiting the new sim, but it won’t be my only one. I will continue to purchase some payware but with prices going through the roof, I’ll wait for a sale.

[rhumbaflappy]

Based on the many comments I've been reading since the E3 announcement of the rebirth of MSFS, I've come to one rather disturbing conclusion...

By the time that MSFS is released from final beta, the talent pool of aircraft modelers and gauge/systems programmers will be nearly non-existent. Slow or no sales of new aircraft means no way to pay the employees, who will be forced to update their resumes and seek out job opportunities.

I've spent the past two decades learning and polishing my crafts. It will take years before new product for MSFS from third parties to become available.
Hi Bill.

I'm afraid you may be right! Certainly scenery developers will take a big hit too. No need for any development other than Airport development. All terrain elements and non-airport buildings will be done by Azure AI. There may be room for landmarks, but who would buy them? The decision to release an alpha SDK is open to only a very few invited developers.

[fliger747]

Very interesting. I expect that there may be some serious limitations here for those of us with more limited streaming capability available. The video is visually impressive, but I was disappointed in the reviewer not really discussing the flight dynamics and how those are derived.

Many possibilities here but even the current intensity in producing a top level aircraft for FSX/P3D is quite significant and may make the bar high indeed.

[wombat666]

Keep one very, very important point at the forefront of the collective mindset(s)......Microsoft are not doing this because they care about flight simming, the flight sim community or because they are the 'Good Guys' and they really care.
It's all about making money, nothing more, nothing less.
MS have thrown 'us' under the bus previously and if it suits they will not hesitate to do so again!
Believe nothing and trust them not at all.
:redfire:

[Naismith]

It'll kill off P3D too.

[Dangerousdave26]

It'll kill off P3D too.

In theory they don't compete in the same market since P3D is not for recreational use.



Very interesting. I expect that there may be some serious limitations here for those of us with more limited streaming capability available. The video is visually impressive, but I was disappointed in the reviewer not really discussing the flight dynamics and how those are derived.

Many possibilities here but even the current intensity in producing a top level aircraft for FSX/P3D is quite significant and may make the bar high indeed.

Airboyd discussed that in his video. He was so awstruck by the visuals he did not have time to concentrate on systems or flight model. Their goal is realism so hopefully they have someone working on that item.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkMoZkGhIog

[heywooood]

The only issue I have with it is it's marriage to win10 - or the return of windowsME as I see it. Hopefully when microsoft moves on to the next OS (hopefully a better one) they'll bring the new flight sim with it. That's when I'll buy it.

[bazzar]

Why is it that whenever something new and exciting pokes up over the horizon, people go running for cover? Microsoft is a very large, experienced, professional organisation that doesn't do things lightly. Yes they made mistakes with Flight but they obviously have the confidence in the market and community to forge on with this next generation game.

I really do not think that MS will be ignoring the greater percentage of developers and community support who have assisted greatly in maintaining the FS franchise for decades. Why would they do that? They have already shown us that they intend to have some level of compatibility with existing assets and that an off-line version will be made available in which these assets can be used.

To suggest that developers will "die" is ridiculous. Most good developers will adjust, adopt and adapt. Just like they have done for years with all the other platforms that were never going to fly.

So will people keep buying product for the other platforms? Of course they will - for two very good reasons that have nothing to do with logic or common sense - "ooh new shiny thing!" and good old curiosity. Those who are going to 'stick" with their existing platforms will still want new stuff or are we all going to stop here and not upgrade anything? Come on. People are still making things for FS8 and 9 for heaven's sake.

There will be a requirement for devs to learn new tricks but that's nothing new. We already have the material and equipment to do this - Microsoft have already said so. My guess is that we will be working with adapting existing work for the fastest response and redeveloping other subjects to match quality expectations. So what's new or difficult about that?

At AH, we are embracing this bold, new world. We can't afford not to. But that isn't the real reason. It's because this is the best thing we've seen in this hobby for a very long time. Do I want to be part of that?

You bet.:engel016:

[stansdds]

Well said, Bazzar! Honestly, FSX is old. P3D is built on FSX, so it also looks old. Other sims have advanced and make FSX look almost cartoonish. It's past time for a replacement that is fresh, new, and gets away from all the bad stuff that legacy code brings.

[BendyFlyer]

I can only agree Bazzar. I am signed up to the FlightSim 2020 Insiders and have been not looking at the lovely but listening to various discussions by the development team. It is clear to me that they are or have addressing all the issues that made FSX and Steam so difficult. i.e Direct X and 32 bit and the base O/S environment. Ignoring the hype about Petabytes of this and that it is clear they have taken a completly different approach to the world model and build up a simulator environment based on a very wide spectrum of real world data. They are also incorporating a lot of new software via third parties and partnerships with those firms to rebuild the very model engine and the dynamics of the new environment vis a vis cloud, weather generation, wave generation etc etc. They are clearly exploiting the considerable capabilitie of the latest graphical capacity via DX11 etc. They seemed sincere when they said or hinted that MS had dropped the ball on Flight Sim ( that means they suddenly realised they got rid of about 20 million customers - ooops!)

The aim as I understand it is essentially ONLINE but they are also have recognised the variable band and internet speeds so are employing a cache system so even if you want to go use it offline a basic cache will provide the basics and the basics are pretty good from the videos I have seen.

Memory and Internet Bandwith are the key issues for all of us. The offline cache is about 68GB as the team said in a discussion there is no point in downloading the whole world (The Petabyte thing) but the bit your flying in or to and from which makes it a whole more manageable. The specs for the PC being used or demonstrated on are nothing super just a high quality modern multicore processor and reasonable RAM etc nothing more than is required for P3D.

They are being cagey about the sim models either as default or add on flight models and I guess my reasoning is the new sim engine will not run say an FSX model without some serious rebuiding and work because the new engine takes into account a large number of dynamic variables aerodynamically, not that there not known but just they are keeping the real world approach they have taken to the scenery to the sim model behaviour in it. They have said nothing about AI or the Living World aspect (ships, animals cars ground vehicles etc. ) so no idea what they have in mind there. That being said the current default list is basically similar to FSX, a couple of jets, a couple of lighties, a glider and an old piston (the DC3).

My gut feeling is it will ship as a base operating system with sim-internet connectivity and file architecture that will give some stuff but not a lot enough for the data transfer to then fill in the gaps so to speak. Whether that will be via a license or pay as you go process they are not saying.

My major concern is not new hardwared my rig is due for replacement anyway but internet connectivity and for a lot of folk all over the planet that is a major issue either you cannot get the bandwith or you cannot get the speeds needed. I guess if you live in Silicon Valley it will be great but rural Australia for example, forget it it will never work the internet is too flaky and too slow to do it.


I think listening to the Development Team talk they have had carte blanche to make this thing work and work in the 21st Century and I like their approach and what they have done but when all is said and done if you want that level of realism which they will deliver then you need Petabytes of data stored somewhere because the world is a very big place indeed. Getting it in chunks as you need it is fine by me.

Yes I am impressed and yes I will stick with FSX for the foreseeable future and I actually lookfoward to getting the world and its environments in one package after all with al the scenery addons I have bought or sourced my FSX world is pretty close to half a terrabyte anyway so the numbers they quote are fine.

Price? Who knows it won't be cheap but it won't be expensive either probably about current X-Box rates I would say after the initial base software package purchase.

[zswobbie1]

It amuses me when people regard backward compatibility as a criteria in getting Microsoft Flight Simulator, as well as those who feel it important to tell the community that they will no longer buy any more add-ons for their sims for the next year or so.
Seriously guys, we dont actually care if you stop your purchases.

Backward compatibility?? I'm sure you are aware that FSX aircraft's flight characteristics are using a single contact reference point as compared to the 1000 per surface that the MSFS's aircraft will have? Consider the new sim as being a totally new sim!

Also, the comment that MSFS will kill P3D... I'm sure that all are aware that P3D is a commercial product, used for training, & not for entertainment? Yes, LM does allow that do not qualify to purchase, whereas MSFS, as per the T's & C's, is NOT for commercial use, therefoe is an entertainment product? Therefore 2x sims for 2 different markets?


Bazzar tells it like it is, Good words there!

So, please, We are not really interested if you are going to stop buying add-ons, or if you are not going to buy the new sim because of streaming issues, if it will only work on Windows 10, if there's no VR on release, etc.. Guys, we getting a new sim in about a years time....

[fliger747]

Hopefully helicopters will come along at some point, the world environment being shown would be very good for helicopter flying.

As far as P3D goes, I was involved in a particular Corsair project, not sure how many Corsair pilots we are training?

That the emphasis is on scenery and no one seems to have commented on flight dynamics I am not holding my breath. FSX etc were OK and we learned to deal with them and certainly we learned how to make many work arounds to deal with weak points. In theory one could say that an airplane basically acts around a point, the CG, but this did lead to some limitations, especially in tail draggers. With some luck items such as multi stage supercharging, jet engine thrust, EPR, ground friction, lateral friction and braking will be much improved.

I hope that they don't go subscription model. It's the surest way to loose customers, giving them a constant reminder that they can evaluate and opt out.

[J.Case]

Hopefully helicopters will come along at some point, the world environment being shown would be very good for helicopter flying.

As far as P3D goes, I was involved in a particular Corsair project, not sure how many Corsair pilots we are training?

That the emphasis is on scenery and no one seems to have commented on flight dynamics I am not holding my breath. FSX etc were OK and we learned to deal with them and certainly we learned how to make many work arounds to deal with weak points. In theory one could say that an airplane basically acts around a point, the CG, but this did lead to some limitations, especially in tail draggers. With some luck items such as multi stage supercharging, jet engine thrust, EPR, ground friction, lateral friction and braking will be much improved.

I hope that they don't go subscription model. It's the surest way to loose customers, giving them a constant reminder that they can evaluate and opt out.


I've got no clue what you're talkin' about :distrust::confused-new:- or to put more plainly: that's exactly what I thought....
I wouldn't put too much into the lack of fde comments though: how many guys with PPL/ATP have flown the new sim up to now ?And all 2 of them seemed fairly convinced about the touch and feel....
I do see a lot of oportunities on the other side of the cockpit door/the black curtain though......:jump: Espacially for 3rd party developers: I'm still frozen in awe about the B-26 of Shupe Industries and one can only dream of what this would do to a B-24 or Halifax or Shakleton or Orion or....
Interiors that would either be redicously simplyfied due to vector constrains or slow the fps to a crawl with all those VCs. There are ways around that - just not out of the box.

Flying straight and level would then only be the choice of airline pilots - great!

Btw: Do we know anything about the roadmap for p3d ? V5 is about due!?

[n4gix]

I think listening to the Development Team talk they have had carte blanche to make this thing work and work in the 21st Century and I like their approach and what they have done but when all is said and done if you want that level of realism which they will deliver then you need Petabytes of data stored somewhere because the world is a very big place indeed. Getting it in chunks as you need it is fine by me.

You won't need 2 petabytes of local storage. They have it all stored in the Azure Cloud. It will be streamed on-demand as you fly along, as long as you are on-line.

For off-line use, simply pre-cache your departure airport and your destination airport. Allow the sim to use the default off-line scenery in between the two. At anything over 5k feet, there will be enough detail to use.

[kiki]

”Would you buy an usea car from this man?” = Would you buy a flight sim from Microsoft?

[n4gix]

Yes I would! :wavey:

[paiken]

I'm all in. Been virtually flying Microsoft Flight Simulators since the 1980's on my trusty old Apple IIc (I still have that computer. Sadly the floppy disk died some time back in the early 90's. I have a version around here somewhere that I can run on a virtual machine). I'm just gonna sit back and watch people go thru the usual bickering and moaning about how Microsoft this and Microsoft that and just enjoy a chuckle to myself about how completely awesome that first Flight Simulator was in its day. Don't even ask about the frame rates!

[Bomber_12th]

I'm already feeling quite anxious for its release, even though it hasn't even reached the alpha stage yet, let alone beta. I've watched this video already probably a dozen times: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmoG8jgdQvQ and listening to Froogle discuss his experiences with using the sim last month has me ever more interested and confident that it is going to be a fantastic program (and I'm glad that a bit of information about the specs of the computers that Microsoft are using to run the sim were leaked, as I can begin gauging my next computer purchase). Even from these early glimpses it is visually just so far and above any other flying sim out there, and I don't see any of the other sims heading in a direction that would approach the level it is at already - the very complex lighting and atmospherics, all interconnected/working together, perhaps impresses me the most, but also impressive is the incredible draw distance of the scenery and clouds, the 3d trees and accurate density of trees, the satellite-produced real scenery the world over (in incredibly high resolution in some regions), with proper buildings and trees drawn from that satellite imagery, the authentic look of water, sky and clouds, etc. Other than assuming it will require a subscription to run in online mode, its checking all my boxes (even with a subscription cost, I'm sure many of us will still be saving money by not buying scenery/weather/sky/cloud addons since it won't need those). I'm really looking forward to seeing what the complete list is of the 400 cities that are covered by photogrammetry.

[rhumbaflappy]

I think the new sim will get a lot of grins when we get the release version. Very much looking forward to it.

[Javis]

I'm all in. Been virtually flying Microsoft Flight Simulators since the 1980's on my trusty old Apple IIc (I still have that computer. Sadly the floppy disk died some time back in the early 90's. I have a version around here somewhere that I can run on a virtual machine). I'm just gonna sit back and watch people go thru the usual bickering and moaning about how Microsoft this and Microsoft that and just enjoy a chuckle to myself about how completely awesome that first Flight Simulator was in its day. Don't even ask about the frame rates!

I seem to remember, back in those days, frame rates weren't invented yet ??.... :)

My first ever Flight Sim was called 'Night Flight' on a Sinclair 48K Spectrum. Very good naming choice because 'the scenery' consisted of 2 rows of 12 white dots (may have been even 16..) representing the runway, rest was pitch black. A couple rudimentary instruments including ADF to help find the runway. I was in extacy finding it for the first time because i knew diddly squat about aerial navigation. Loved it to death ! I pinch myself everyday to check i'm not dreaming about Microsoft picking up its once beloved Flight Simulator franchise where it was abandoned years ago in such unbelievable gobsmacking way. ( it does seem to be too good to be true, doesn't it...)

[bazzar]

Spitfire 40 was my first flight sim. Played on a tape drive Amstrad. Couldn't wait for the tape to stop graunching away and I could see the pea green screen with a flock of tiny dots coming my way. A straight single line for a runway. Hitting the dots gave a surprising amount of satisfaction...

[b52bob]

I seem to remember, back in those days, frame rates weren't invented yet ??.... :)

My first ever Flight Sim was called 'Night Flight' on a Sinclair 48K Spectrum. Very good naming choice because 'the scenery' consisted of 2 rows of 12 white dots (may have been even 16..) representing the runway, rest was pitch black. A couple rudimentary instruments including ADF to help find the runway. I was in extacy finding it for the first time because i knew diddly squat about aerial navigation. Loved it to death ! I pinch myself everyday to check i'm not dreaming about Microsoft picking up its once beloved Flight Simulator franchise where it was abandoned years ago in such unbelievable gobsmacking way. ( it does seem to be too good to be true, doesn't it...)
This also was my first sim along with a program I think was called “Air Mail” or something like that. You had to fly three different places to deliver mail. Wire frames, black backround and a frame rate of .02 on my trusty Atari 800.

[Desert Rat]

My first ever Flight Sim was called 'Night Flight' on a Sinclair 48K Spectrum.

relive your youth, https://www.worldofspectrum.org/infoseekid.cgi?id=0003418

[Javis]

relive your youth, https://www.worldofspectrum.org/infoseekid.cgi?id=0003418
Thanks, DR ! A wonderful trip down 48K memory lane !! :ernaehrung004:

(someone i met in the pub lent me his Commodore64 including a tape of Sublogic Flight Simulator II. Didn't mean anything to him. I was deeply in love. That was the end of my beloved Spectrum. I bought the, by then, brandnew Atari ST. :cool: )

[Desert Rat]

This was my first, came with my 48k

https://www.worldofspectrum.org/infoseekid.cgi?id=0001797

This is the one I remember playing most,

https://www.worldofspectrum.org/infoseekid.cgi?id=0002183

This was the most impressive,

https://www.worldofspectrum.org/infoseekid.cgi?id=0001752

How about getting one of these?
https://www.specnext.com

I remember giving my 128k+2 fully boxed with mouse, joysticks and hundreds of games away to a friend, what an idiot I was.

PS. for Baz, https://www.worldofspectrum.org/infoseekid.cgi?id=0004763

[wombat666]

I really feel like a noob!
My first sim was IL2 Pacific Fighters, purchased primarily as a gesture of support to the developer as I read where some 'Corporate-Bloody-Lawyers' employed by one of the major manufacturers were attempting to sue the devs for using the name of a long obsolete aircraft built by defunct company.
That lead me to CFS2 - CFS3 - FS2002 and so it continued.
I never really got that enthused about IL2 but I made a small point.
:devilish:

[Javis]

This was my first, came with my 48k ....



Wow! Actually quite a lot of flightsim stuff for the Spectrum, huh ! I gave up on it because of the lent C64 and my own Atari ST ( bought it because of a Flight Simulator II version for this machine which had much better graphics compared to the C64) Beside 'Nightflite' i remember one game i had for the 48k : Manic Miner. Hilarious and extremely addictive ! :D

And one thing more about Nightflite : hey, future Flight Simulator flyers, put this in your pipe and smoke it :

https://youtu.be/73u95S6fE8Q

:mixed-smiley-010:

[bazzar]

Excellent DR thankyou. I love the way they attempted some refraction in the gunsight reticle! Now I wonder if there is a paintkit...

[Phantom88]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVUyD_CwCUc

[n4gix]

I watched that earlier this morning. I've managed to get my jaw re-attached now so at least I can eat supper! :dizzy:

The icing is truly awesome!

[paiken]

I watched that earlier this morning. I've managed to get my jaw re-attached now so at least I can eat supper! :dizzy:

The icing is truly awesome!

The icing on the cake, so to speak. Those guys have done the incredible. Even their "outrageous French accents" (Monty Python reference) don't bother me. Love the video. I was trying to see what plane was being worked on in the background but of course it was just the right amount of out of focus to make it difficult as hell.

[stansdds]

Wow! That's incredible! I think this is where I say "shut up and take my money!". I'll need a new computer, that is certain, so I'm interested in seeing exactly what one will need in order to truly enjoy this new flight sim.

[Moses03]

Some amazing development there.:encouragement:





Even their "outrageous French accents" (Monty Python reference) don't bother me.

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/montypython/images/0/07/Montypythonfrench.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20070904000009

[p14u2nv]

I've always dreamed of flying through a Cat 5 hurricane force winds in a P-3A Orion at 13fps! Now there's a bucket list accomplishment! lol

[zswobbie1]

Wow! That's incredible! I think this is where I say "shut up and take my money!". I'll need a new computer, that is certain, so I'm interested in seeing exactly what one will need in order to truly enjoy this new flight sim.

I think that a new operating system comes first.

[wombat666]

Interesting thus far that it's all about scenery and weather but SFA about actually 'flying'........:devilish:

[jeansy]

Interesting thus far that it's all about scenery and weather but SFA about actually 'flying'........:devilish:

or open SDK for 3rd party developers

[stansdds]

I think that a new operating system comes first.

It's going to have to be a whole new computer system for me. I've gotten more than my money's worth out of this old machine and it has lasted longer than any of my previous computers. I can say the same for FSX.

[TuFun]

I've always dreamed of flying through a Cat 5 hurricane force winds in a P-3A Orion at 13fps! Now there's a bucket list accomplishment! lol

Something like this?

Unreal Engine 4.23 - Speedtree - Substance Designer now put that in a sim.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ecerIIClbMA

[Bomber_12th]

There are supposedly lot of things still not hashed out yet, with the sim still being up to another year away from release (it hasn't even entered alpha testing yet, let alone beta). The Microsoft representatives have stated that their main focus for everything that has gone into this sim is the hard-core PC flight simmers, and they're placing a lot of importance on supporting addon developers, and will be discussing the SDK in the future.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nmfmYfXOI1w

Everything I have seen/heard thus far has really left me gobsmacked, especially so since they are running it top line on a currently rather reasonable system. I'm amazed by the new standard of atmospherics, the scenery (and especially the way it is produced), the water, sky and clouds, weather, etc. - it looks and acts so much closer to reality than any other sim that has come before, and I don't see how any other current sim, in their current structure, could come close to matching it. Just the video/screenshots shown thus far illustrate how vastly immersive the sim experience is/will be.

I have seen several videos by those who got an early, unrestricted hands-on look at the sim back in September, and among so many other topics, they all touch on the new flight dynamics. There has been a lot mentioned about how the new flight modeling is fed by over 1000 data points spread across all the surfaces of the model, interpreting how those various surfaces are interacting with the air around them (including wind and air density), and that the aircraft no longer act/feel as if they are on rails. Among other things, it allows for far more accurate stall and spin characteristics, and accelerated stalls, with the surfaces of the aircraft's wing, fuselage, tail truly being taken into account in various angles of attack, turns, and slips (stalling differently/accurately depending on which surfaces are or are not creating lift and drag at any given time, as well as taking into account g-loading and side-loads/forces, etc.). I've also heard that they have more accurate ground friction modeling now too, which also takes into account the nature and conditions of the surfaces the aircraft is traversing. I've also heard a lot of good about the new sound engine and the quality of the sounds, and the new dynamic sounds, such as sounds from rolling over the runway or terrain, sounds from being bumped around by turbulence, etc.

[Dangerousdave26]

Interesting thus far that it's all about scenery and weather but SFA about actually 'flying'........:devilish:

Per the Development road map the next video due out in Mid November will be about Aerodynamics.


or open SDK for 3rd party developers

October 17th was the Partner Announcement Series kickoff. The update we should see is not until mid November. They are working with some 3rd party developers but now but it must be pretty hush hush.

Its far too early to discuss an SDK but they did discuss addons at the Developer Q&A last month. Watch this video at 8:21 the question is asked.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-ppN8HjZGk&t

[jeansy]

It will be interesting whether its a selected sdk or open sdk

My concerns as its going through xbox live it will be DLC only for both platforms not to disadvantage any users

Which appears to me like msflight all over again, the biggest loser in this outcome will be the pc platform, where the number of developers will be severely limited to producing addons that can be used easily on both platforms.

Lots of pretty images and videos but no real raw expansion details.

[Daube]

Hmm didn't they announce quite early in the videos or updates that DLC could be downloaded from any sources ?

[jeansy]

Hmm didn't they announce quite early in the videos or updates that DLC could be downloaded from any sources ?

yeah but they havent said anything whether its a selected sdk or open sdk, that could mean MS approved addons via a 3rd party vs 3rd party

any source could mean, xbox live and xbox live pc, I cant see xbox users downloading from any fs website as we know it, its one game that works for 2 platforms, so what ever is designed will need to work for both xbox and PC, to me that severely limits the quality of the addons, and from what they have said so far its looks like it will be limited to what you can mod.

I cant see them making 2 different versions of this, one for PC and 1 for xbox, from early remarks from them its designed to work together with both platforms so you can fly online with someone with another platform.

if thats the case a number of developers may stay clear of this

[Daube]

You can't see them doing two versions, one for PC and one for XBox, but this is clearly what they have officially announced in their videos and interviews.

The fact that XBox users can't access external (non-MS) DLC doesn't mean anything. XBox users can't download cars or tracks from AssettoLand website, for example, while PC users can. So why would it be a problem from the new FS ?

As for the "closed" SDK, what would MS earn with such a choice, excepted the hate of the community ? Don't you think they understood the MS Flight mistakes ?

[jeansy]

You can't see them doing two versions, one for PC and one for XBox, but this is clearly what they have officially announced in their videos and interviews.

The fact that XBox users can't access external (non-MS) DLC doesn't mean anything. XBox users can't download cars or tracks from AssettoLand website, for example, while PC users can. So why would it be a problem from the new FS ?

As for the "closed" SDK, what would MS earn with such a choice, excepted the hate of the community ? Don't you think they understood the MS Flight mistakes ?

Youre misunderstanding the reference

Im refering to 2 seperate tailored versions of the same sim ie 2 complete seperate sims that will operate differnet from each other,

A well known fact is when MS port xbox to pc or vice versa normally keep everything as close as possible so people can interact with other people on the opposite platform
I seen it too often with my xbox accounts both on xbox and pc

its been confirmed its the same version of the sim ie coding and logic that will work on both platforms

Saying that the level of coding and addons will be limited to they can run on both, so things as simple as A2A or MJs c47 will be dumbed down in order for xbox users thats even if they have unrestricted sdks

The whole idea of a pc sim with msfs will change as it will be tailored for the lesser of the 2 platforms and its a mind set that people dont undertand or havent comprehended yet

Until the sdk is openly released and 3rd party developers can have a look and give an idea of the limaitions impossed its way too early to get excited over pretty images and a monthly subcription fee

But from your posts you are missing my point

[zswobbie1]

What must also be noted is that the forthcoming Xbox will be totally different to the older one, and we have no idea if it will be able to sideload any addons. So the previous DLC comment above, is redundant. Pure speculation, not fact.

[jmig]

I for one, look forward to trying the new sim. I am so tired of all the problems and maintenance needed to keep PD3/FSX running correctly. It never fails, you get the sim running nicely and a week or so later something happens, leaving you scratching your head wondering why your nicely running sim is now DOA.

I don't blame the developers for trying to program around the sim's limitations. They are trying and usually do create a better running, flying, looking, etc product. The problem is that when you have a dozen different developers doing work-arounds sooner or later some code from one developer will conflict with code of another developer. Then we, the users, are left scratching our heads.

It looks like the new sim will come with a lot of current add-ons built in. The developers will also have a much more viable and rich set of basic code to build new aircraft, scenery, or whatever is needed. Hopefully, there will be little need of work-arounds.

As much as I am not an Apple fan, I will admit that their 3rd party restrictions and control helps their products to work well.

[p14u2nv]

Something like this?

Unreal Engine 4.23 - Speedtree - Substance Designer now put that in a sim.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ecerIIClbMA

Exactly TuFun. I first saw UE a few weeks ago on Youtube and was at a loss for words then as I am now. If this will soon be reality as in having an active weather system based on actual and accurate real time weather input...I may indeed be able to get a feel for what an Orion is like in such wicked weather! I just hope this latest pc can handle it...keeping fingers crossed.

[stansdds]

I for one, look forward to trying the new sim. I am so tired of all the problems and maintenance needed to keep PD3/FSX running correctly. It never fails, you get the sim running nicely and a week or so later something happens, leaving you scratching your head wondering why your nicely running sim is now DOA.

I don't blame the developers for trying to program around the sim's limitations. They are trying and usually do create a better running, flying, looking, etc product. The problem is that when you have a dozen different developers doing work-arounds sooner or later some code from one developer will conflict with code of another developer. Then we, the users, are left scratching our heads.

It looks like the new sim will come with a lot of current add-ons built in. The developers will also have a much more viable and rich set of basic code to build new aircraft, scenery, or whatever is needed. Hopefully, there will be little need of work-arounds.

As much as I am not an Apple fan, I will admit that their 3rd party restrictions and control helps their products to work well.

I gotta agree. I'm still on FSX, due to my antiquated computer. P3Dv4 looks great, but every time there is a version update, a bunch of things get broken, then the 3rd party developers have find solutions. Maybe if MS keeps a strict set of rules for 3rd party developers, we won't have such problems.

[bazzar]

It doesn't really matter if a new simulator is built for XBox, PC or your old granny's black and white TV. If people want it, they will buy it and adapt or change the way they play. If there is an SDK then developers will build add-ons. That will never change.