Flightsim Survey 2018 results are in - what do we think?

[Ganter]

The results of the biggest most comprehensive "ever" Flight Sim Community Survey done since the 2014 Vatsim survey are in.

What do we think in the outhouse I wonder...(in which we do not get a mention) - which I'm sure we do not care about either...

http://blog.navigraph.com/post/181243982766/flightsim-community-survey-2018-results

Answers here - or in Canelo's Cantina...

[Moses03]

Looks like P3D and X Plane are neck and neck for popularity.

What jumps out at me is how few (those who responded to this particular survey anyways), choose to fly online or in some kind of mutli-player environment. Flying with others is the most fun in my opinion.

Also noted that only 57% of the respondents say they use rudder pedals. That is a deal breaker for me. Without a yoke (or joystick) and pedals, FS would seem more like an arcade game.

To each his own though.

Kevin

[bazzar]

In order to interpret these findings, one needs to understand the background. Navigraph specialise in providing "high end" technically advanced services to aviation and the flight sim market. Their customers are generally those who frequent on-line airlines, fly groups and hard-core enthusiasts. These people are not in general, SOH members as their preferences are usually for tube liners and GA aeroplanes. The survey was promoted on sites most frequented by this type of simmer. The future for Navigraph lies with P3D and X-Plane so no surprises there. Population densities would provide the demographics, with the US of course, leading the way.

So, again, no surprises for developers, just the same old data, re-framed and re-presented.:engel016:

[falcon409]

. . . .What jumps out at me is how few (those who responded to this particular survey anyways), choose to fly online or in some kind of mutli-player environment. Flying with others is the most fun in my opinion.
Kevin
That has always seemed to be a hurdle folks just are not willing to get past. The SOH Server is a typical example. I'm on it every day for the most part but have to drop off when it's time to pick up my Great Granddaughter from school. I have been online like that for years and can say with a large degree of certainty that the normal participation on any given day can be counted on one hand. . .many times I never see anyone. There was interest in WWII Flying and so a channel was set up specifically to give those folks somewhere to meet and fly. I have never seen anyone (on a consistently regular basis) use it.

I log on at night from time to time just to see who is on. . . .no one. That doesn't mean no one is "ever" on, but I'm online in TS enough to know that the SOH Multi-Player server is being wasted. The excuses range from "No time", to "I don't like the way I sound", or "My English is not very good". . ."it's too hard to get setup". . ."I don't know what I'm doing". . . .most of which are easily fixed. As far as the language barrier. . .if you can say "yes, no, I understand, ok and thanks", that's about all that's necessary. You don't have to be a great conversationalist. . .just get on and fly.

[TuFun]

Interesting to see website traffic and entertainment... full breakdown.

https://download.navigraph.com/docs/navigraph-flightsim-community-survey-2018-final.pdf

[Josh Patterson]

That has always seemed to be a hurdle folks just are not willing to get past. The SOH Server is a typical example. I'm on it every day for the most part but have to drop off when it's time to pick up my Great Granddaughter from school. I have been online like that for years and can say with a large degree of certainty that the normal participation on any given day can be counted on one hand. . .many times I never see anyone. There was interest in WWII Flying and so a channel was set up specifically to give those folks somewhere to meet and fly. I have never seen anyone (on a consistently regular basis) use it.

I log on at night from time to time just to see who is on. . . .no one. That doesn't mean no one is "ever" on, but I'm online in TS enough to know that the SOH Multi-Player server is being wasted. The excuses range from "No time", to "I don't like the way I sound", or "My English is not very good". . ."it's too hard to get setup". . ."I don't know what I'm doing". . . .most of which are easily fixed. As far as the language barrier. . .if you can say "yes, no, I understand, ok and thanks", that's about all that's necessary. You don't have to be a great conversationalist. . .just get on and fly. I would fly with you Falcon. I got a headset a while back and got on a server but I couldn't hear any transmissions. I was able to chat with another member there but I never figured out what was going on in game and gave up. I always thought a group warbird display would be fun. How do the channels work here? I'm in the "I don't know what I'm doing" group but like you say, easily fixed. I did sign up in the flight center so I'll do some poking around in there for a bit.

[thunderstreak]

My issue with online flying is real life inevitably gets in the way. My sim sessions always get interrupted by someone or something. As far as I understand pauses are a no no while flying online. I’m fortunate that the VA I belong to allows pauses. Otherwise I might actually have an interest in something like VATSIM or joining in online flights.

[DC1973]

That has always seemed to be a hurdle folks just are not willing to get past. The SOH Server is a typical example. I'm on it every day for the most part but have to drop off when it's time to pick up my Great Granddaughter from school. I have been online like that for years and can say with a large degree of certainty that the normal participation on any given day can be counted on one hand. . .many times I never see anyone. There was interest in WWII Flying and so a channel was set up specifically to give those folks somewhere to meet and fly. I have never seen anyone (on a consistently regular basis) use it.

I log on at night from time to time just to see who is on. . . .no one. That doesn't mean no one is "ever" on, but I'm online in TS enough to know that the SOH Multi-Player server is being wasted. The excuses range from "No time", to "I don't like the way I sound", or "My English is not very good". . ."it's too hard to get setup". . ."I don't know what I'm doing". . . .most of which are easily fixed. As far as the language barrier. . .if you can say "yes, no, I understand, ok and thanks", that's about all that's necessary. You don't have to be a great conversationalist. . .just get on and fly.

I flew on-line for 10 years here in the UK with a military VA, MODsim. For most folks, it was getting used to speaking to others / fear of making mistakes that prevented most people from moving forward with it. Multiplayer is tremendous fun, and I only left the VA to focus on my development for the sim.

I think the survey is very revealing in the way that users are moving forward with X-Plane. It's now roughly an equal to the MS sims in terms of users, although I do appreciate that the survey mostly focused on GA and commercial air users rather than military fans. Now, if X-plane could only introduce seasonal terrain textures then it might be worth thinking about making the move as they seem to have every other base covered...

[Daube]

I flew on-line for 10 years here in the UK with a military VA, MODsim. For most folks, it was getting used to speaking to others / fear of making mistakes that prevented most people from moving forward with it. Multiplayer is tremendous fun, and I only left the VA to focus on my development for the sim.

I think the survey is very revealing in the way that users are moving forward with X-Plane. It's now roughly an equal to the MS sims in terms of users, although I do appreciate that the survey mostly focused on GA and commercial air users rather than military fans. Now, if X-plane could only introduce seasonal terrain textures then it might be worth thinking about making the move as they seem to have every other base covered...

Well, I don't know for seasonal textures, but very soon you'll get accumulating snow on ground as well as real volumetric clouds like what we *almost* got in FlightSimWorld with TrueSKY...
https://forum.thresholdx.net/topic/241-110-development-screenshots/?page=6
(tons of screenshots from the alpha/beta, check all pages :) )

XPlane11 has made a lot of noise when it appeared, and we all know that a lot of OOM-frustrated users of FSX/P3Dv3 jumped on the other side of the fence and never came back. That sim has a lot of good stuff. Even the default planes are already impressive...

Concerning the multiplayer flight, I agree with your remark about people being afraid of doing something wrong.
In most forums, multiplayer flights means IVAO or VATSIM, places where you're supposed to follow real world procedures and communications, not places you go just to have fun...

With the exception of FSX-Steam, most of the sims require external software in order to connect to/create any multiplayer session. In P3Dv4 and previous versions, I have been using the JoinFS program, and recently I started using FFS2Play. Both are far from perfect, plane movements are jittery when flying in close formations, many things just don't work, etc... It's a lot of obstacles for anybody new willing to discover multiplayer. I'm not surprised by the very small amount of people flying in multiplayer, really...

[DC1973]

Well, I don't know for seasonal textures, but very soon you'll get accumulating snow on ground as well as real volumetric clouds like what we *almost* got in FlightSimWorld with TrueSKY...
https://forum.thresholdx.net/topic/241-110-development-screenshots/?page=6
(tons of screenshots from the alpha/beta, check all pages :) )


WOW!! That's truly something else! If they can achieve those effects with decent FPS then it might be enough to push me into switching to X-11 development, or at the very least prioritising conversions onto that platform. Hugely impressive, and I already own X-Environment so the upgrade won't be an issue.

[Javis]

Now, if X-plane could only introduce seasonal terrain textures then it might be worth thinking about making the move as they seem to have every other base covered...

Not in my flightsim book they haven't, sir... I had Xplane10, overwhelmed by the nightlighting i was, yessir, but it was a cold and lonely place. Nobody around, no ATC to talk to, no other aircraft, nothing, i felt as lonely as a mouse in the Royal Albert Hall... Could very well be that Xplane pilots suffer from seperation anxiety....

Once Xplane gets good ATC and AI i'm on it like a car bonnet :teapot:

[Javis]

Well, I don't know for seasonal textures, but very soon you'll get accumulating snow on ground as well as real volumetric clouds like what we *almost* got in FlightSimWorld with TrueSKY...
https://forum.thresholdx.net/topic/241-110-development-screenshots/?page=6
(tons of screenshots from the alpha/beta, check all pages :) )

Holy Volumetric Noise Rendering Batman !!

Captain Kitten for President !! :applause:

Thanks for that link, Daube ! About 30 years we have been waiting for something like this, haven't we !

Just too bad the waiting doesn't seem to come to an end that soon...

Lets all make a vow we don't touch P3Dv4 anymore before LM (or anyone else) promises us this type of cloud rendering is in the pipeline. Haven't we looked at this damn 'whispy cloud' bitmaps long enough now!!??? :mixed-smiley-027:

Anyway, thanks again, Daube, the future looks bright and cloudy ! :encouragement:

Oh, and to get back on topic, i found it pretty peculiar to see my home airport EHAM come second place as most popular departure airport (with EDDF at number one). I was like " Huh??? " ..... ;-)

[Daube]

I agree with your remarks Javis. I really was amazed when I saw these clouds, especially because I had lost all hope to see them in our *regular* sims since FSW went down to the trash...
The accumulating snow, I simply thought it would not be possible at all to implement something like that in a sim. If I understood properly, it might work on ortho scenery as well !?...

But, as you said, right now, waiting is the only thing we can do... So I wait. And during that wait, I keep trying to get a bit more comfortable with XP11. The emptiness/loneliness is indeed a problem, but then again I have deactivated all AI traffic in my P3D as well, to save as much FPS as possible for the VR mode :biggrin-new: So in that aspect, XP11 is not so different than my P3D :)

[Javis]

I agree with your remarks Javis. I really was amazed when I saw these clouds, especially because I had lost all hope to see them in our *regular* sims since FSW went down to the trash...

Yes, what a letdown that was, wasn't it. They were sort of my hero's what with TS that i loved for years ( not anymore, alas...) and then taking up the gauntlet to produce a brand new (sort of) flightsim. The only fun out of that i have now is to throw every advert/note i still get from them unseen in the trashcan.


The accumulating snow, I simply thought it would not be possible at all to implement something like that in a sim. If I understood properly, it might work on ortho scenery as well !?...

I wouldn't know, you tell me something new here again... accumulating snow... Wow! :cool:


But, as you said, right now, waiting is the only thing we can do... So I wait. And during that wait, I keep trying to get a bit more comfortable with XP11. The emptiness/loneliness is indeed a problem, but then again I have deactivated all AI traffic in my P3D as well, to save as much FPS as possible for the VR mode :biggrin-new: So in that aspect, XP11 is not so different than my P3D :)

Ah! You're into VR ! Also Wow! I still have VR only in the back of my head... ;-) I'd like to give it another year or maybe two before going into the third dimension. I don't think my current rig can handle it neither. It must be the beez knees, i'm sure ! Envy you ! :cool:

[AusWilko]

Well, I don't know for seasonal textures, but very soon you'll get accumulating snow on ground as well as real volumetric clouds like what we *almost* got in FlightSimWorld with TrueSKY...
https://forum.thresholdx.net/topic/241-110-development-screenshots/?page=6
(tons of screenshots from the alpha/beta, check all pages :) )

XPlane11 has made a lot of noise when it appeared, and we all know that a lot of OOM-frustrated users of FSX/P3Dv3 jumped on the other side of the fence and never came back. That sim has a lot of good stuff. Even the default planes are already impressive...

.


WOW!! That's truly something else! If they can achieve those effects with decent FPS then it might be enough to push me into switching to X-11 development, or at the very least prioritising conversions onto that platform. Hugely impressive, and I already own X-Environment so the upgrade won't be an issue.

As someone who for the last 3 years has been in a plane twice a week, good clouds (atmosphere) are something that might bring me back to flight simming again, been racing as I got disgruntled with watching the price of things rise and decided I needed a break, mean while I gotta say I am mighty interested in XP11 these days.

[TuFun]

Holy Volumetric Noise Rendering Batman !!

Captain Kitten for President !! :applause:

About 30 years we have been waiting for something like this, haven't we !

Lets all make a vow we don't touch P3Dv4 anymore before LM (or anyone else) promises us this type of cloud rendering is in the pipeline. Haven't we looked at this damn 'whispy cloud' bitmaps long enough now!!??? :mixed-smiley-027:



President Captain Kitten hurray!!!

xEnviro... TruClouds and accumulative TruSnow... now that's something to talk about!

I vow not to use P3Dv4... don't have it so that one is easy! :biggrin-new:

Awsome...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZHaKi_w374