Man steals plane, does loops.

[PRB]

This story has a tragic ending, but probably what he intended. At least he only killed himself.

https://abc7news.com/stolen-plane-crashes-after-unauthorized-takeoff-at-seattle-airport-source/3928151/

[Daveroo]

was watching some live youtube feed of this last night,at fires i thought it was old news,as it all seemed kinda surreal..it wasnt long before i figured it out,but wow.

[Mike71]

News clips I see do not show any loop; he does a nose high aileron roll (needed with a slow roll rate), the nose fall through as he gets wings level, pulls out of a very nose low attiude at low altitude. Seems he has flown something before, maybe some lessons or ride-alongs. in order to start and taxi, he was no rookie. Maybe a qualified runup mech or something??

[hairyspin]

The old adage still holds - takeoffs are optional, landings are mandatory. What a muppet.

[PhantomTweak]

Nothing official was said, but there's rumors he may have been suicidal. If he was, he succeeded.

Odd sidenote: Attempted suicide is illegal. Successful suicide isn't. Go figure. :dizzy:

At least he didn't take anyone else with him, thankfully. Expensive methodology, though. Not to him, but hey...

Pat☺

[Victory103]

Will the FBI contact Majestic for sales records of the Q400?

[Naismith]

There will no doubt be a media knee jerk reaction to a) airport and aircraft security and b) he mentioned he had flown simulators, so awaiting again the hysterical media outflow just as we had post 9/11.

Anyway RIP kid, sympathy goes out to your wife and family who have to carry on.

[stansdds]

Odd sidenote: Attempted suicide is illegal. Successful suicide isn't. Go figure. :dizzy:

Pat☺

I never understood that either.




There will no doubt be a media knee jerk reaction to a) airport and aircraft security and b) he mentioned he had flown simulators, so awaiting again the hysterical media outflow just as we had post 9/11.

Anyway RIP kid, sympathy goes out to your wife and family who have to carry on.

Seeing as how many regulations, restrictions, and laws are knee-jerk reactions, it would not surprise me to see our hobby regulated.

[Roxane-21]

Odd sidenote: Attempted suicide is illegal. Successful suicide isn't. Go figure. :dizzy:

I never understood that either.

You cannot prosecute a dead person (IIRC this is actually written in the law of most western countries). Therefore, making successful suicide illegal is useless.

[n4gix]

For the record, he was a 'ramp rat' (baggage handler). He had worked there for only three years.

[Priller]

For the record, he was a 'ramp rat' (baggage handler). He had worked there for only three years.

He was a very troubled young man with obvious mental problems. Proof once more that 21st century society doesn't give a rats @ss about the mentally ill.

There's no need to use derogatory terms to describe the people who make sure that our luggage travels with us.

Priller

[heywooood]

you can find his audio communication with the tower on youtube (23 minutes or so) where the controller is handling his usual load of traffic AND this guy very professionally..
the 'pilot' admits to having some idea of how to control the plane because he 'has played games, flown on the computer' before.

the audio is compelling and tragic and surreal..all at once. This person was suffering from mental illness and seemed not to have planned to do this - just thought about it a time or two most likely and then
unfortunately was presented with an opportunity not at all out of line with his job, clearances, and access.

I was surprised that the controller who was handling him was not apparently isolated from his other duties. But probably due to abysmal under staffing had no option to focus directly on this situation. He maintained his composure throughout.

[heywooood]

He was a very troubled young man with obvious mental problems. Proof once more that 21st century society doesn't give a rats @ss about the mentally ill.

There's no need to use derogatory terms to describe the people who make sure that our luggage travels with us.

Priller

this is a proper statement - thank you.

[mrogers]

There's no need to be derogatory towards the guy...it's a very sad situation and I really do feel for the poor guy and his family.

[gman5250]

I listened to the ATC recordings of the event. Radio traffic was heavy, as you would expect around Sea-Tac, but the conversation between ATC and the young man seemed sparse. When he mentions barrel rolls ATC seems confident they can talk him down, but after some time he declares he might be losing an engine. ATC told him to keep the plane over water, but from that point to impact there was little contact.

Truly bizarre that someone could successfully start a complex aircraft, taxi and TO at a busy facility in the manner that he seems to have done it.

I'll be interested in learning the actually cause of the crash...mechanical failure(s) or intentional suicide.
Either way, it is sad and regrettable.

[Roxane-21]

I'll be interested in learning the actually cause of the crash...mechanical failure(s) or intentional suicide.

... or a novice so-called pilot trying to do a barrel roll at low altitude with a heavy twin-turboprop airliner?



Truly bizarre that someone could successfully start a complex aircraft, taxi and TO at a busy facility in the manner that he seems to have done it.

There are many companies here (and there might be in your country as well) which anybody can give a fairly low amount of money to get a one-hour course in a professional airliner simulator. I did it last year for my father's birthday.

[Mike71]

[QUOTE=Roxane-21;1151150]... or a novice so-called pilot trying to do a barrel roll at low altitude with a heavy twin-turboprop airliner?

From the film I have seen, he was apparently able to pull off a nose high aileron roll, which is NOT a barrel roll, though the two are often confused, especially in an airplane with a relatively low roll rate. Aileron rolls in such a plane wind up nose low at the end unless they are started with high enough nose high attitude to prevent it from "scooping out" at the bottom without stalling during the maneuver. A true barrel roll hits specific combinations of heading and nose attitude changes throughout the maneuver.

[wombat666]

Leaving aside the speculation re how he flew it and what 'maneuvers' he may or may not have performed along with his mental state..........what happened with Airport Security?
:banghead:

[gman5250]

He was pushing the airplane hard. The forensics will establish exactly what led to the crash.

He nearly put it in the water here. He had asked ATC if 5000ft. was a good altitude to initiate a roll. ATC recommended that he not try that.


https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=stolen+airplane+sea+tac&&view=detail&mid=1AE2A1241C0BD72CE7701AE2A1241C0BD72CE770&&FORM=VRDGAR

[Roxane-21]

what happened with Airport Security?
:banghead:

If I understand the situation correctly, this guy was (due to his job) allowed to be on the apron next to the airplanes. Then, it was only a matters of seconds to get on the plane and sit on pilot's seat. So, not much thing Airport Security could do to prevent what happened.

[Mike71]

If I understand the situation correctly, this guy was (due to his job) allowed to be on the apron next to the airplanes. Then, it was only a matters of seconds to get on the plane and sit on pilot's seat. So, not much thing Airport Security could do to prevent what happened.
I wonder what ground control was doing as he taxied - did he ask for taxi to a runup area for maintenance etc, or did ground control think they had a lost comms issue? Curious --

[heywooood]

He was a credentialed ground crew person tasked with moving aircraft via tug, loading and unloading all aspects, not just luggage, and was entitled to be virtually anywhere on the airport grounds in compliance with all current regulations. He towed the airplane from a maintenance area to an inactive runway and got it off the ground. One spokesperson said he had to have the engines synchronized and so known the procedures well enough not just to fire it up, but configure it for take off.
In FSX or XPlane there are Q400 with systems and checklists that are accurate enough to make this possible for a layman.
Possible that might be changed in the near future because our society looks for easy fixes rather than face the real issues. The authorities are still unpacking this one - just found part of the cockpit recorder (so they can hear conversations he may have had with himself or via cell phone) and the flight data recorder. He was able to locate and read his fuel state and headings and seemed to think he could’ve landed if he wanted to. With a ground stop and all that traffic piled up on the ground and in the air that would have been ridiculous. He seemed aware of that by his remarks. I’m most interested in what the people around him might reveal - he came unwound but could it have been a complete surprise?
That would be unusual. Someone had to know his gears were slipping.

[n4gix]

There's no need to use derogatory terms to describe the people who make sure that our luggage travels with us.

Priller

It may only be a language barrier issue, but "ramp rat" is a very commonly used term, used even amongst themselves, and is in no way "derogatory..."

See: https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=ramp%20rat

Further information reported is that he was also certified for tug operations, meaning that he had been trained to start the APU to provide power and hydraulics during tug repositions of the aircraft.

[Roxane-21]

I wonder what ground control was doing as he taxied - did he ask for taxi to a runup area for maintenance etc, or did ground control think they had a lost comms issue? Curious --

Honnestly, after they told him he was not allowed to taxi, what else could they have done? Throw a truck across his path, which would have led to the loss of said truck and maybe its driver as well? Fire a TOW missile to destroy the Q400 (not sure this kind of equipment is common on a civilian airport)?

When the man decided to taxi and taxeoff, there was nothing (NOTHING, N-O-T-H-I-N-G) the ground control could have done to prevent him to do so.

[dvj]

Conspiracy theorist proclaim that Soviet Mig 21's not F15's shot down the plane. Migs have a solid history of shooting down commercial aircraft. President Trump asked Putin if he did it. Putin said "No, we are Russian not Soviet". Trump tells congress, "I believe him". Sad!

Source: RT

[wombat666]

People have very short memories. :banghead: