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mike_cyul
February 3rd, 2018, 11:32
Just in case you're interested, some work-in-progress screenshots of the Handley Page Halifax Mk.III. Still things to do, obviously, but it's slowly coming along. I have to say, getting to know this aircraft has been a very enjoyable process.

Mike

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4675/28285423049_5bf6cec842_k.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4759/28285424909_058e85e846_k.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4656/40032276452_57dd731147_k.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4610/40032275882_a7cb6e963a_k.jpg

WarHorse47
February 3rd, 2018, 12:10
Count me in. Love that cockpit. :very_drunk:

Bradburger
February 3rd, 2018, 12:12
Gorgeous work there Mike.

Cheers

Paul

JamieC
February 3rd, 2018, 12:19
Looks awesome

A lot of great aircraft coming out in the future, going to be spending a bit of money I think!

MustangL2W
February 3rd, 2018, 12:26
Gorgeous.... Another one to WAIT for!

AussieMan
February 3rd, 2018, 12:52
Going to have to put my CC in a cool place. With this Halifax and the AH Lancaster it is starting to overheat wit excitement. Used to fly the Alpha Sim Halifax a lot in FS9 and FSX but sadly it no longer works in P3D.

thefrog
February 3rd, 2018, 13:03
VC and exterior looking great!

jamminjames
February 3rd, 2018, 13:09
Two thumbs up!!!!!

Anthin
February 3rd, 2018, 13:40
Wow. What a great VC. Brilliant !

Anthin.:encouragement:

Sundog
February 3rd, 2018, 14:12
It's looking great Mike, thanks for the previews. :)

mike_cyul
February 3rd, 2018, 15:03
Thanks, guys :) . If you happen to be interested in learning more about Halifax's and in particular their operational history, there a great group on Facebook that I discovered when doing the research. Ken Marshall posts daily the Bomber Command diary entries for the present date, but 75 years ago (currently at Feb.3, 1943). Great place to get a feel for RAF bomber operations on a day-by-day basis, in real time. Highly recommended, and lists not just for the Halifax, but for all RAF bombers (seeing as there's an excellent Lancaster coming up) and what they were doing that day, plus the outcomes. https://www.facebook.com/groups/360779000665606/

Mike

SSI01
February 3rd, 2018, 17:25
WOW!!

Count me in!

Pips
February 3rd, 2018, 17:52
Woohoo! :) Looking very nice. Especially that cockpit. :D

Naismith
February 3rd, 2018, 23:34
Beautiful - and a largely overlooked aircraft... :encouragement:

Ferry_vO
February 4th, 2018, 02:16
That looks absolutely awesome Mike! :encouragement:

It always amazes me that the British only had one pilot who had to wrestle such a large aircraft, must have been exhausting flying one of those on a night mission to Germany and (Hopefully) back..

Roger
February 4th, 2018, 03:32
Never thought we'd see an FsX/P3D Halibag, so it's brilliant that Mike is making one:applause:

simondix
February 4th, 2018, 03:34
I believe that one of the reasons you had one pilot was you only lost one. He had the Flight Engineer to assist in things like throttle control on take off.

huub vink
February 4th, 2018, 03:37
Great choice Mike, the model looks really stunning :encouragement:.

Cheers,
Huub

txnetcop
February 4th, 2018, 04:18
As usual Mike you pick the coolest of the cool to do for flightsimming. I'm still in love with the DC-4!:jump::jump::jump:
Ted

IanP
February 4th, 2018, 06:00
Already got a Haliibag base done to fly it from... This one is very much on my wishlist!

Quick questions though, Mike, if I may?

Do you use LODs? I'd love to make an AI file to put a bunch of Halifaxes around the dispersals at Elvington, but experience says that might not be a good idea (read: won't be!) if it's trying to load all the detail on all the models at the same time.

Also, are any of these squadrons likely to be represented, please? 77Sq RAF, 346 "Guyenne" or 347 "Tunisie" squadrons, FFAF - these were the Halifx units based at Elvington, so would obviously be the ones I'd like to see.

Don't ask for much, do I? :engel016: <whistles innocently>

All the best,

Ian P.

mike_cyul
February 4th, 2018, 06:53
Already got a Haliibag base done to fly it from... This one is very much on my wishlist!

Quick questions though, Mike, if I may?

Do you use LODs? I'd love to make an AI file to put a bunch of Halifaxes around the dispersals at Elvington, but experience says that might not be a good idea (read: won't be!) if it's trying to load all the detail on all the models at the same time.

Also, are any of these squadrons likely to be represented, please? 77Sq RAF, 346 "Guyenne" or 347 "Tunisie" squadrons, FFAF - these were the Halifx units based at Elvington, so would obviously be the ones I'd like to see.

Don't ask for much, do I? :engel016: <whistles innocently>

All the best,

Ian P.

Hi Ian,

I haven't really got that far in planning things, but have briefly considered doing something like the freeware formations I did for the B-17 and C-47. In which case, there would be some low poly Halifax models that could be used. However, I don't believe the RAF used the very structured formations such as those of the USAAF, and so the incentive isn't high, not to mention that during night ops you likely wouldn't see another aircraft. However, I'll definitely keep your idea in mind. Would be nice to have a Halifax base to operate from!

No paint specific schemes picked yet, and whatever isn't done on initial release could be covered by the inevitable paint kit. :)

Mike

jankees
February 4th, 2018, 07:26
That looks great Mike, a sure buy from me, and with a paintkit I'm sure we can make Ian happy!

IanP
February 4th, 2018, 07:48
Thanks Mike.

I don't want to hijack your thread, so won't mention it any more beyond this, but Elvington is already in the "All in One" download of my stuff - EGYK is the ICAO. It looks like it could do with some re-work before I package it up on it's own, which is unsurprising, as I originally only created it for that slightly odd stiz guy who lurks around here occasionally (I'm sending him a link to this post, so he can clip me around the ear for that remark... ;) ) but now we actually have a Halifax coming to the sim, that makes it a lot more worth the effort to spruce the airfield up. :)

The RAF bombers tended to operate in flights, three or four aircraft, flying in a continuous stream, rather than the US-style boxes, simply because they were trying to defeat radar and radar-guided interceptors, as oppose to the day fighters that the US encountered. The bomber streams weren't liked by the crews, who always feared collisions, but were proven to be a very effective defence, until better equipped night fighters (particularly those with upward-firing guns) came onto the scene. For that reason, a similar "combat box" formation to the B-17 one of yours that I have installed, I don't think would be particularly appropriate. I'm not sure how you'd be able to recreate a stream, in the sim, particularly well. I guess I'll have to go without my AI models. Oh well! :D

Cheers,

Ian P.

wombat666
February 4th, 2018, 07:53
Hi Ian,

I haven't really got that far in planning things, but have briefly considered doing something like the freeware formations I did for the B-17 and C-47. In which case, there would be some low poly Halifax models that could be used. However, I don't believe the RAF used the very structured formations such as those of the USAAF, and so the incentive isn't high, not to mention that during night ops you likely wouldn't see another aircraft. However, I'll definitely keep your idea in mind. Would be nice to have a Halifax base to operate from!

No paint specific schemes picked yet, and whatever isn't done on initial release could be covered by the inevitable paint kit. :)

Mike

The 'Bomber Stream' was the order of the day.
Or as an old (family friend) Bomber Command pilot now deceased put it, a 'Bloody great string of stragglers'.
Maynard had a curious war (His words) as he started off with Coastal Command pre 1939 and progressed through Bomber Command onto Special Operations, all the Cloak and Dagger SOE agents into occupied territory etc.
A thoroughly nice man and very 'British', shame he left us too soon, as I never did get answers to a lot of my questions re SOE.
:medals:

IanP
February 4th, 2018, 12:37
onto Special Operations, all the Cloak and Dagger SOE agents into occupied territory etc.

Well, it's worth pointing out here that both 138(SD) and 161(SD) Squadrons used... Handley Page Halifax bombers. ;)

138 were the most commonly associated with them, 161 primarily with Lysanders, but heck, 161 did ops using an Avro Anson I, Bostons, Wellingtons, Whitleys, Austers, Halifaxes, Mitchells, Oxfords, Sterlings... Even a Havoc I (BJ477/MA-R). If they could get their hands on it and it did what they needed it to, it was used!

Specifically for 161(SD) Squadron, I have DG286 (MA-X), a Halifax II, and LK738 (MA-T), a Halifax V, both used between 11/42 and 10/44. For 138(SD) Squadron, I have Halifax IIs JD172 (NF-S) and W1209 (NF-A), Halifax Vs LK473 (NF-J) and DG252 (NF-B). W1209 was used 10/42-08/44 and DG252 03/43 - 08/44. I don't have that info for the other two, to hand... But plenty more Halifaxes that I've already got a home for, there, Jankees! :)

Cheers,

Ian P.

J.Case
February 5th, 2018, 02:01
absolutly stunning:dizzy: . . . . btw - what kind of interior setup do you envision?

mike_cyul
February 5th, 2018, 04:39
absolutly stunning:dizzy: . . . . btw - what kind of interior setup do you envision?

Sorry, don't quite understand the question?

Mike

J.Case
February 5th, 2018, 05:30
Hi Mike,

The pics from the cockpit are just awe inspiring - as far as I remember it's been a single pilot cockpit, back to back with the flight engineer and with a Navigator sitting between the bombadiers compartment and the Pilot together with the radio operator with something remotly reminding me of an isle running along the fuselage . . .

it looks like a couple of square miles for extra instrumentation, camera positions and eye candy:untroubled:

mike_cyul
February 5th, 2018, 06:26
Hi Mike,

The pics from the cockpit are just awe inspiring - as far as I remember it's been a single pilot cockpit, back to back with the flight engineer and with a Navigator sitting between the bombadiers compartment and the Pilot together with the radio operator with something remotly reminding me of an isle running along the fuselage . . .

it looks like a couple of square miles for extra instrumentation, camera positions and eye candy:untroubled:

Yes, and unusual arrangement, with the radio operator sitting right below the pilot's position. The flight engineer had a folding seat so as to be able to assist the pilot when needed, but as far as I can tell nothing permanent (A second control yoke and pedals could be installed for training). Navigator and bombardier together in the nose, but separated by a curtain.

To copy and paste from a reply on a different forum: If as pilot you lean over and peer down into the passageway, you'll see that the radio operators curtain is closed, as is the one leading forward to the navigator and bombardier's positions. Having curtains there is authentic (and necessary, as there won't be enough polygons available to suitably model other compartments). But leading rearwards, aft of the flight engineer's station behind the pilot, we're going to have to assume that the crew decided they didn't want light coming up front in case anyone brewed some tea in the centre section, and jury rigged a curtain sealing off the fuselage interior. :)

I will try to make it so that a little light leaks around the curtains, so you'll know your crew is hard at work at their individual jobs as you fly the aircraft.

Mike

gribouil
February 5th, 2018, 07:59
Hi Mike,
THis Halifax is really beautiful... and what a cockpit!!!
you can count me in if you add liveries from (Free French) No.346 or 347 Squadrons that were based at RAF Elvington near the city of York... :ernaehrung004:
Cheers,

Stéph.

mike_cyul
February 5th, 2018, 08:39
Vous pouvez compter sur ça. :)


Mike

gribouil
February 5th, 2018, 08:49
Yes!!! :ernaehrung004::ernaehrung004::ernaehrung004:

IanP
February 5th, 2018, 13:23
Guess I'm definitely updating my Elvington as well, then. :engel016:

Ian P.

BendyFlyer
February 7th, 2018, 23:19
This is looking pretty good Mike. A fascinating aeroplane, solid operational record, interesting postwar use as the Halton. You going to include the Halton? not that it matters that much, I am in for this one too.

mike_cyul
February 8th, 2018, 04:39
This is looking pretty good Mike. A fascinating aeroplane, solid operational record, interesting postwar use as the Halton. You going to include the Halton? not that it matters that much, I am in for this one too.


Yes indeed, the H.P. 70 Halton will be in there, too.

Mike

BendyFlyer
February 9th, 2018, 03:58
Yes indeed, the H.P. 70 Halton will be in there, too.

Mike Great news. Look forward to the release sure lot of things to do in the meantime. The Bristol Hercules engine sounds will be tricky. I presume it will be the MK III. Well if I may suggest a possible fitting paint would be 462 Squadron RAAF who operated these from 1942 to 1944 and were a pure Halifax Squadron only in WW2. Interestingly this Squadron was mostly poms for awhile but were basically Mediteranean based and did the Africa campaign etc and it was not until 1944 they went back to the UK and joined the Bomber Command campaign.

SSI01
February 9th, 2018, 04:17
The Halifax was supposed to be much easier for the pilot to get out of in an emergency than the Lancaster, but on the other hand, the Lancaster was judged by no less an authority than Sir Arthur Harris to be the superior aircraft.

I can see what was meant about that ease of departure. It looks like a lot roomier cockpit than a Lanc had.

simondix
February 9th, 2018, 05:07
That thing about the roomier cockpit reminds me of Martin Shaw [Actor] relating at one Duxford show how Brewster Buffalo pilots took evasive action. They ran around in the cockpits.

mike_cyul
February 9th, 2018, 05:37
The Halifax was supposed to be much easier for the pilot to get out of in an emergency than the Lancaster, but on the other hand, the Lancaster was judged by no less an authority than Sir Arthur Harris to be the superior aircraft.

I can see what was meant about that ease of departure. It looks like a lot roomier cockpit than a Lanc had.


I think the appearance of a roomier cockpit is just the perspective that an FSX VC gives. That said, Halifax's did have a slightly wider fuselage, with less encumbrances, and crews appreciated the extra room both during normal ops and especially in emergencies. The Halifax had a higher survival rate than did the Lancaster. That said, the pilot still had to find and clip on the parachute (in the dark) before using that nice large hatch above him, and once centrifugal forces set in if the aircraft spun I imagine it was as next to impossible to get out of as anything else. And the pilot would stay with the aircraft longer than anyone else before trying to get out.

As far as which is superior, the Lancaster or the Halifax, that's probably a good discussion, but I think the early model Halifax with Merlin engines was definitely inferior (apparently primarily due to problems with propwash over the wing due to the Merlins' placement) and needed a long development period, not to mention the rudder stalls with the early tail shape. The later Hercules-engined variants with the square fins were as good as anything else. The Lancaster came out-of-the-box in pretty good shape and so had less of a history of headaches. From Harris' point of view, the Lancaster could carry much larger bombs due to the bomb bay design, and that's what counted for him!

Mike

AussieMan
February 9th, 2018, 14:22
The Lancaster came out-of-the-box in pretty good shape and so had less of a history of headaches. From Harris' point of view, the Lancaster could carry much larger bombs due to the bomb bay design, and that's what counted for him!

Mike


Actually Mike The Lancaster was a derivative of the Avro Manchester. Lack of power and performance forced Avro to redesign the Manchester by extending the wingspan to 102ft and adding 4 Rolls Royce Merlin engines although a mark of the Lancaster retained the Bristol Hercules engines.

wells
February 9th, 2018, 18:17
Awesome! I'll be all over this one!

dhasdell
February 9th, 2018, 22:36
The Halifax was supposed to be much easier for the pilot to get out of in an emergency than the Lancaster
Unfortunately I can't remember where it was, but somewhere I've seen a comparison of survival rates of crew members of shot down Lancasters and Halifaxes. All too often the rear gunner was the only survivor from a Lancaster.

Paul K
February 10th, 2018, 08:33
Actually Mike The Lancaster was a derivative of the Avro Manchester. Lack of power and performance forced Avro to redesign the Manchester by extending the wingspan to 102ft and adding 4 Rolls Royce Merlin engines although a mark of the Lancaster retained the Bristol Hercules engines.

Not to pre-empt Mike, ( and I'm sure he's as aware of the Manchester as any of us ) - I think what he means is that the Lancaster was a success from the day the prototype first flew, whereas the Halifax suffered from performance and aerodynamic problems, and was developed through a number of marks before it evolved into the B.Mk III. The latter was considered to be every bit as capable as the Lancaster ( more so, according to some ), but it took time to get there. The Lancaster, on the other hand, was a success from day one.

Just for info, it was the Mk. II Lancaster that was fitted with Hercules engines, though it was not something retained from an earlier version.

SSI01
February 10th, 2018, 09:24
I read somewhere those Mk IIs went mostly to No. 6 (Canadian) group.

In a biography of Harris I've got somewhere, I remember him writing the Halifax was what he termed "a typical Handley-Page product," whatever that meant. I know he had earlier experience with fixed-undercarriage HP bomber products so maybe he was transferring his opinion from the older to the new product. I know the earlier marks had stability problems with the smaller rudders plus the slightly shorter wing with the rounded tips.

Interestingly, the Manchester suffered from a rather poor power plant, the RR Vulture engine. Supposed to have been prone to running hot, and to fires. That's something that was a rarity, I suppose - a RR engine that wasn't up to snuff.

Gibson flew the aircraft for a while, but I can't remember if he wrote or said anything about it. "Enemy Coast Ahead" AFAIK covers only his operations flying HP Hampdens.

dhasdell
February 10th, 2018, 11:55
Gibson flew the aircraft for a while, but I can't remember if he wrote or said anything about it. "Enemy Coast Ahead" AFAIK covers only his operations flying HP Hampdens
No, It covers Hampdens, Beaufighters, Manchesters and Lancasters including the Dams Raid, but with little specific detail for security reasons.

stiz
February 11th, 2018, 05:53
few things to note - the Halifax had to make do engines it wasn't designed for, it was planned for it to have the same merlin engines as spitfires and hurricanes had, but due to being told "no chance" it had to make do with weaker engines, eventually leading to the dumping of the merlins altogether. The lanc got the engines it wanted and was designed for from day 1 because by then then we were making enough! Also from pilots accounts the issue with the tail depended on pilot experience, those who knew about it didnt think it was a problem, but it caught out the lesser experienced pilots. It was also easier to survive a halifax crash because it tended to break apart into sections and you could actually move about in it, unlike the lanc, where it was very tight inside.

The Manchester's were just an utter failure by all accounts, flew horribly and spent more time having its engines fixed than flying!

Also, the Halifax cockpit WAS roomier than the lanc, having been in one it is actually very spacious and very easy to move around in, you do step rather than crawl and can pretty much stand upright :)

As to harris .. he only liked the lanc because it could carry more bombs further, and thats all that mattered to him, he didnt give tuppence to anything else!

BendyFlyer
May 16th, 2018, 01:38
Heads up for those interested, latest pictures updating progress on the Halifax posted over on the Flight Replicas Facebook page. Looking very good at this stage.

mike_cyul
May 16th, 2018, 12:15
Thanks, Bendy. :)

And here are a few more new screenshots, as the dedicated BOAC version is now complete.

Keep in mind that everything is still a work in progress, however!

After this, it'll be on to making more textures for the wartime Mk.III's.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/912/42156284391_3942c8f462_k.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/944/27284842327_ed535170d3_k.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/909/27284841627_d1e30bd290_k.jpg

mike_cyul
May 16th, 2018, 12:17
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/909/42156283891_659e82e0e5_k.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/965/27284840997_50e62dcd0b_k.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/963/42156283311_1ed2369eb7_k.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/961/42156283081_64068b58cb_k.jpg

Mike

Roger
May 16th, 2018, 14:03
Excellent Mike!

WarHorse47
May 16th, 2018, 14:15
Thanks, Mike.

I really appreciate the updates and screenshots. Beautiful work so far. Definitely on my "must get" list.

thunderstreak
May 16th, 2018, 15:00
Thanks for the updates. Really looking forward to flying this one!

txnetcop
May 16th, 2018, 15:19
Thanks for the update Mike...that is one beautiful cockpit!
Ted

Seahawk72s
May 16th, 2018, 17:33
Over the top detail.. As has been said a must have..!

stiz
May 16th, 2018, 20:49
she's a beauty all right !! :applause: :applause:

fancy sticking merlins on her so we can do MK2 Srs 1a schemes? :monkies::engel016:

YoYo
July 19th, 2018, 09:54
Any news? Release date/status? :wavey:
Will it work with P3Dv4?

IanHenry
July 20th, 2018, 00:33
Here's an interesting little film looking around the interior of the Halifax:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2zypfAVMRJc&amp;t=237s&amp;index=26&amp;list=PLY7ffAAK j6xAS-uPJxwNWrMYeVjNUkcew


Rgards,
Ian

IanP
July 20th, 2018, 03:35
Mike: You mentioned you're getting on with wartime paints - is there any chance of an Elvington based one (Friday the 13th, for example) to go with the scenery I just updated, please?

Cheers,

Ian P.

mike_cyul
July 20th, 2018, 07:54
Any news? Release date/status? :wavey:
Will it work with P3Dv4?

Sorry, I'm just being slow with things (plus it's summer and am trying to spend more time outdoors!). The Halifax is done except for one item, and I've started to build the website pages for the release. If all goes well, I expect it to be out within the next couple of weeks.

And yes, works in all versions of FSX and P3D.

mike_cyul
July 20th, 2018, 07:57
Mike: You mentioned you're getting on with wartime paints - is there any chance of an Elvington based one (Friday the 13th, for example) to go with the scenery I just updated, please?

Cheers,

Ian P.

Hi Ian. Looking forward to seeing your airfields. As for airfield-specific paint schemes, there's a paint kit with the Halifax and it should be a relatively easy job to make specific aircraft if there's not one that matches.

IanP
July 21st, 2018, 08:41
I'm trying to not keep mentioning this, because I'm not complaining about the situation, it's just a simple fact - I'm afraid I won't be getting the Halifax because we don't have the money to spare to get it. Therefore I won't be doing any repainting, either.

Can someone who can afford to get it please do a 77sq, 346sq or 347sq repaint to go with Elvington, please? :jump:

Cheers,

Ian P.

jankees
July 21st, 2018, 09:46
there's the possibility I might be tempted...

mike_cyul
July 21st, 2018, 10:08
I'm trying to not keep mentioning this, because I'm not complaining about the situation, it's just a simple fact - I'm afraid I won't be getting the Halifax because we don't have the money to spare to get it. Therefore I won't be doing any repainting, either.

Can someone who can afford to get it please do a 77sq, 346sq or 347sq repaint to go with Elvington, please? :jump:

Cheers,

Ian P.

Just checked, and 346 Squadron is already a part of the package. So that's one off of the list. :)

IanP
July 21st, 2018, 12:39
I've got the markings for a 347Sq FAF aircraft as well, plus IDs but not drawings/photos of MZ715/KN-Z as a 77Sqn Mk.III.

How many people would I upset if, given access to the paintkit, I did Special Duties repaints on the wrong airframe? :devilish:

Cheers,

Ian P.

JamieC
July 28th, 2018, 12:31
I see it's out now...time to head on over and buy it!

Roger
July 28th, 2018, 12:36
Please head over to the release thread for any further comments.

http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php/111687-Flight-Replicas-Halifax-is-out