Paint Request Please

[gray eagle]

Would like to see a paint of Virtavia's A-4C of VA-153 Blue Tail Flies

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c272/switchblade111/147825-a-4l-va-153-nl302-gerry-markgraff-pmc%20RET.jpg

This is a close up more detailed squadron patch that you see on the plane above, Couldn't get a closer shot of the flying four leg creature.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/85/ac/88/85ac8817d2b4d66b30deb7f8b42b4341.jpg

[awstub]

I don't fly the Skyhawk much any more (if only it were Tacpacked.....), but I just checked and I do have the paint kit for it......so I should be able do it.

The picture you posted is pretty good for reference, but it would be nice to have a few more from different sides/angles....if you can find some.



Stu

[awstub]

Well, I made some pretty good progress with the Virtavia Skyhawk.....until I got to the tail.
The way they have it configured makes it very difficult to paint.
I tried to match the picture exactly, but getting the tail code to show up properly is darn near
impossible because of the separate texture map for the rudder fillets ...which is not the same
scale as the rest of the texture sheet.
It took me a good part of the day just to get the tail to where it is now and with a few more
hours of trial and error I should be able to get the paint lines to match, but I still cant figure
out how to get the paint onto the horizontal stabilator side plates.
Unless someone knows a way for me to take care of these issues, I'm going to have to shelve it for a while.

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e233/z98bot10a/frustrating%20A-4_zpssrrl2ry7.jpg

[DaveB]

Thanks very much for your efforts Stu. I actually dug the PK out for this and took a look before deciding I didn't need to look any older than I already am!! I'm happy to take it 'as is' if you're happy to let it go like that;)

ATB
DaveB:)

[WarHorse47]

I'll take it, too. Looks great. Thanks, Stu. :encouragement:

[Duckie]

Well, I made some pretty good progress with the Virtavia Skyhawk.....until I got to the tail.
The way they have it configured makes it very difficult to paint.
I tried to match the picture exactly, but getting the tail code to show up properly is darn near
impossible because of the separate texture map for the rudder fillets ...which is not the same
scale as the rest of the texture sheet.
It took me a good part of the day just to get the tail to where it is now and with a few more
hours of trial and error I should be able to get the paint lines to match, but I still cant figure
out how to get the paint onto the horizontal stabilator side plates.
Unless someone knows a way for me to take care of these issues, I'm going to have to shelve it for a while.



Hi awstub, if you're using the paintkit from Virtavia, make the "Background" layer visible and the wire mesh becomes visible with all the parts labeled. The rudder is offset and I don't believe it is a different scale. You should be able to make a tem[plate for the V-tail and rudder by cutting and pasting a copy of the rudder to fit the v-tail. Do the striping and reposition it to the original. Some trial and error with incremental adjustments may be necessary to fine tune the final fit. Same for tail codes.

Stock paint kit wire mesh background layer

49411

Cut and pasted copy made into template for paint stripes across v-tail and rudder.

49412


Hope this helps.

[awstub]

Thanks Duckie for trying to help, I really appreciate it. I actually did what you mention and it only partially worked for me. When you try add the tail codes the rudder is actually offset vertically from the stabilizer and it just takes a lot of trial and error to get it to show up correctly. Also, you have to play with the area that covers the rudder fillets to have them align with the rudder texture....which again takes a lot of trial and error.
I went with the smaller tail codes because they don't cover the rudder. Otherwise I would have had to worry about lining up all three textures instead of just the two.

I'm pretty much done (or at least as far as I'm willing to go with it right now) and I'll try to upload it later today.
The Skyhawk's folders are set up in a fairly strange manner, compared to normal FSX aircraft, so it will be up to each user to get it to work.
What I've done with mine was convert it to a "normal" FSX installation by creating a single A-4 folder and copying all of the different model folders into it...as well as the other files an folders needed to get it to work. I'll add this info to the readme so others can di it if they wish.

Anyway, here's what it looks like right now:


http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e233/z98bot10a/A-4E%20Finished%202_zpsbhwjd5qa.jpg


http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e233/z98bot10a/A-4E20Finished_zps5cdq43ex.jpg

[Duckie]

Well, from what I can tell, it looks like you did a bang up job. You are correct in that the v-tail area is not easy to paint for the very reasons you've stated and encountered. And the folder system...:dizzy:

Still, a nice addition to the A-4 "farm". :encouragement:

[gray eagle]

Thanks Duckie for trying to help, I really appreciate it. I actually did what you mention and it only partially worked for me. When you try add the tail codes the rudder is actually offset vertically from the stabilizer and it just takes a lot of trial and error to get it to show up correctly. Also, you have to play with the area that covers the rudder fillets to have them align with the rudder texture....which again takes a lot of trial and error.
I went with the smaller tail codes because they don't cover the rudder. Otherwise I would have had to worry about lining up all three textures instead of just the two.

I'm pretty much done (or at least as far as I'm willing to go with it right now) and I'll try to upload it later today.
The Skyhawk's folders are set up in a fairly strange manner, compared to normal FSX aircraft, so it will be up to each user to get it to work.
What I've done with mine was convert it to a "normal" FSX installation by creating a single A-4 folder and copying all of the different model folders into it...as well as the other files an folders needed to get it to work. I'll add this info to the readme so others can di it if they wish.

Anyway, here's what it looks like right now:


http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e233/z98bot10a/A-4E%20Finished%202_zpsbhwjd5qa.jpg


http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e233/z98bot10a/A-4E20Finished_zps5cdq43ex.jpg

Looks mighty nice, Thank you for your time and effort in making this paint. My Dad was stationed on Corral Sea back in 64/65 time frame with VF-151 (F4B) and the
Blue Tail Flies of VA-153 were with them. I remember him showing old 8 MM movies of this squadron and him staying there goes another blue tail fly.
I lost my Dad about a year a a half ago (91.5 years) He was an avionics officer (Warrant Officer W-3) with VF-151 back then.
Again, thanks for the paint and it will look great on the deck of the USS Corral Sea. :encouragement:

[awstub]

OK, I just got it uploaded under FSX Military Skins-Vietnam .

It includes five versions of A-4E BUNO 147825 and two versions of A-4F BUNO 155026.

Basically each version is based on the particular model it uses (i.e. with or without drop tanks/bombs/rockets/missiles).

Please let me know if there is anything amiss with it.....it's late and I'm deliriously tired, but wanted to get this "out the door" this weekend.

Stu

[Portia911]

This is a close up more detailed squadron patch that you see on the plane above, Couldn't get a closer shot of the flying four leg creature.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/85/ac/88/85ac8817d2b4d66b30deb7f8b42b4341.jpg

That 'flying four leg creature' would be a Griffin.

[DaveB]

It's up now!! Cheers Stu.. I've almost worn out a mouse this morning clicking on the Warbirds library:encouragement:

ATB
DaveB:)

[jeansy]

OK, I just got it uploaded under FSX Military Skins-Vietnam .

It includes five versions of A-4E BUNO 147825 and two versions of A-4F BUNO 155026.

Basically each version is based on the particular model it uses (i.e. with or without drop tanks/bombs/rockets/missiles).

Please let me know if there is anything amiss with it.....it's late and I'm deliriously tired, but wanted to get this "out the door" this weekend.

Stu

Just think if they did a payload manager like people asked you would only need to do one version instead of several

btw its look quite nice, Im gald you did as the OP send me a request to do it, which i declined to, looks like both parties the OP and painter come of very well

[DaveB]

Did I say the pattern was closed or what!!!!

http://daveb.cbfsim.org/public/pattern2.jpg

Cheers Stu:encouragement:
ATB
DaveB:)

[MDIvey]

Great Repaint thanks Stu.

I've been admiring those camo F-4C paints you've been working on for the SSW Phantom. Do you plan to release those? wondered if you have any plans for this one?... 57 FIS

http://www.verslo.is/baldur/57th_fis/f4/436-a-1000.JPG

Matt

[Mike71]

Nice work!

The original source photo is an A-4C - the repaint an A-4E. However, VA-153 was one of the few squadrons to fly virtually all A-4 models, A-4A through A-4F. Their A-4E's were painted as the photo, but apparently without the squadron patch on the fuselage. These patches, as I recall, were a type of foil material originally. They started to cause problems on A-4's because of corrosion underneath. Stack gasses and hot weather no doubt were an issue and many squadrons stopped using them for awhile. Later I think they made a better type of adhesive and various squadrons started using them again.

The A-4E was a great airplane, no question. Not the fastest, not the biggest, but reliable as hell and wonderful to fly. I flew A-4B's, C's and E's in the fleet, TA-4Js as an instructor, A-4M's as a test pilot. never once did I have so much as a radio failure, let alone anything worse.

[DaveB]

Thanks for posting Mike. A bit of RW info from someone who's been there and done it is always the icing on the cake:encouragement:

ATB
DaveB:)

[gray eagle]

Did I say the pattern was closed or what!!!!

http://daveb.cbfsim.org/public/pattern2.jpg

Cheers Stu:encouragement:
ATB
DaveB:)

Nice photo Dave :encouragement:

Did you use AiTrackerX to make the group photo? I have it and wondered if that was what you used?

[DaveB]

Hiya Butch:wavey:

I used AirTrafficFX for that shot and for most of the others I do though I also have AiTrackerX. I posted a screenie some weeks ago of a black Hunter formation taken at a distance and zoomed. That particular shot wouldn't have been possible with AirTrafficFX so both programs have their uses. AiTX is a much newer program and still in its infancy regarding development so I'm sure it will get better given time. Unfortunately, the extra camera shots it adds brings my rig to its knees so ATFX gets used rather more;)

ATB
DaveB:)

[awstub]

Thanks for the kind words, everyone.

I searched the web for pictures of VA-153 Skyhawks and found a few different variations of their markings.
The ones with the squadron patch actually should have a slightly different tail code placement, where it covers part of the rudder.
Unfortunately, the way Virtavia mapped the textures for the tail makes it terribly difficult to get something that covers both the vertical stabilizer and the rudder to line up properly.
I decided to cheat and use a later version of the letters that does not cover the rudder.....but even still, it literally took me hours to get it to show up in a halfway decent way.

Since it kind of bothers me, I might revisit it at some point and modify it to have the correct style tail code.......it depends on how masochistic I'm feeling at the time.

Also....I couldn't find any pictures of the F models that showed the paint with any detail, so I just guesstimated it.

[awstub]

I will be releasing the SWS Phantom camo paints in the near future. They are mostly done, but I still have to take care of the bump maps so they match some panel door changes I made.
I'm still a novice and I haven't quite learned how to do that properly yet.

As for the checkered tail Phantom, I might be able to do one in the not too distant future, but right now I am busy working with SIR_RIPPER on planning and preparing for an online scenario using the FSX@War Southeast Asia theater.





Great Repaint thanks Stu.

I've been admiring those camo F-4C paints you've been working on for the SSW Phantom. Do you plan to release those? wondered if you have any plans for this one?... 57 FIS

http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/attachment.php?attachmentid=49456&stc=1

Matt

[MDIvey]

Great News

Matt

[gray eagle]

Well, I used AI Tracker AI for this shot. + using the avatar mode in P3d I could use the 1st person and just adjust camera view from what is available.

I sure do appreciate that A-4 paint :encouragement: Thanks awstub ya done good! I had to have my son install your paint, got in a state of flux on step 2 (the pic instructions).

https://s27.postimg.org/4z76fdpeb/launch.jpg

[awstub]

Thanks Gray Eagle.

I'm glad you were able to get it to work. I figured that the install might be difficult for some.
Heck, it was difficult for me to figure it out as well.

One good thing about the "custom" install for these paints is that it will be easier to add more repaints to it, since it follows the "normal" FSX folder/ file conventions.

I'm thinking I might create a few more VA-153 paints, enough to have a flight of four airplanes displaying different numbers.

I should be able to do it rather quickly, since I won't have to mess with that evil tail :)

[DaveB]

Now that's cool. Cheers Stu:encouragement:

Sometimes, you can get away with 'same' registrations on aircraft using ATFX due to the bounding box size of the model in question being oversize but the Skyhawk sits REAL close. I wish other models would sit as close!!

ATB
DaveB:)

[gray eagle]

Hiya Butch:wavey:

I used AirTrafficFX for that shot and for most of the others I do though I also have AiTrackerX. I posted a screenie some weeks ago of a black Hunter formation taken at a distance and zoomed. That particular shot wouldn't have been possible with AirTrafficFX so both programs have their uses. AiTX is a much newer program and still in its infancy regarding development so I'm sure it will get better given time. Unfortunately, the extra camera shots it adds brings my rig to its knees so ATFX gets used rather more;)

ATB
DaveB:)

Wonder if AirTrafficFXwould work with P3D? It looks like it pretty much does the same stuff as the AiTrackerX, any appreciable difference?

[DaveB]

Wonder if AirTrafficFXwould work with P3D? It looks like it pretty much does the same stuff as the AiTrackerX, any appreciable difference?

ATFX doesn't have the ability to position AI like AITX. When you add AI to your flight, it will form on the RH side. If you add another, it will form on the LH side. Add another and it will form on the RH side e t c up to a maximum of 6. Also, you've no control over the distance they form at. This is down to the bounding box size of the model. There's actually a hell of a lot you can do with ATFX that I never bother with but the same can be said with AITX. I find the formations more stable in ATFX. They can shoot off and do their own thing in AITX and the closer you have them, the more likely you are to get them misbehaving!! It's difficult to say that one is better than the other and they both do slightly different things.
ATB
DaveB:)

[awstub]

I use the FSX@War CCP utility to add AI air, land and sea traffic.

With it you can add an AI flight of up to four airplanes that follow a path at specified altitudes and airspeeds. You also specify the formation they use.
It is very easy to use. It literally just takes a minute or two to add a flight.

I used it for this screenshot:

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e233/z98bot10a/MV_Phantom_Escort_hanoi_8_zpsjdchtfmk.jpg

[gray eagle]

I use the FSX@War CCP utility to add AI air, land and sea traffic.

With it you can add an AI flight of up to four airplanes that follow a path at specified altitudes and airspeeds. You also specify the formation they use.
It is very easy to use. It literally just takes a minute or two to add a flight.

I used it for this screenshot:

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e233/z98bot10a/MV_Phantom_Escort_hanoi_8_zpsjdchtfmk.jpg

I wonder if it would work for P3d?

[awstub]

Yes, it works with P3d. Here is a good place to find out about it: https://prepar3d.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=117727

[DaveB]

Stu..

I don't know if you've been able to launch the Skyhawk off Coral Sea with the settings in your cfg but she wouldn't go for me. It was picking up the shuttle at shift+i but was pulled some way forward. Every time I touched the throttle, the launch gear would disengage. Tried it on all 3 cats. Looked at the settings I had for both hook and launch and they were different so I added the ones I already had and tried again. She now picks up the shuttle on Coral Sea and isn't pulled forward. Launches perfectly too;)

Here they are if you're interested:

[TailHook]
tailhook_length= 4.1
cable_force_adjust= 0.95
tailhook_position = -14.7, 0.0, -1.0
[launch_assistance]
launch_bar_pivot = 3.0, 0.0, -1.0
launch_bar_lug = 7.50, 0.0, -1.0

Edit: Oh.. aware of the carrier extensions addition too;)
ATB
DaveB:)

[gray eagle]

Stu..

. It was picking up the shuttle at shift+i but was pulled some way forward. Every time I touched the throttle, the launch gear would disengage.


Dave,

Is this what you mean by way forward? Now when I touched the throttle to max smoke, the launch gear would remain as seen in this snapshot. This is in P3D.https://s8.postimg.org/7qura1w7p/bridle.jpg

Real deal:

http://www.ebdir.net/vsf1/firsta-4bcatapult1965melbourne.jpg

http://a4skyhawk.info/sites/default/files/images-a4-buno/158094f1.jpg

[DaveB]

Yes mate.. she's forward almost out of the box. Even though it was picking up the launch gear.. as soon as I touched the throttle, it disengaged. With the original LaunchAssistance entry added, you drive to the shuttle (park just in front).. engage shift+i .. she pulls the gear and stays put. Launches fine. If it works for you the way it is, don't bother changing it.

ATB
DaveB:)

[DaveB]

Here ya go Butch.

Drive her up and just over the shuttle:
http://daveb.cbfsim.org/public/shuttle1.jpg

shift+i and she only moves a little forward.. pretty much where she should be I reckon:
http://daveb.cbfsim.org/public/shuttle2.jpg

Launches every time with her original launchassistance entry reinstated. Still.. as I said above, if the settings in Stu's aircraft.cfg work ok for you.. I'd not bother changing them. I've not touched the carrier extensions entry btw;)
ATB
DaveB:)

[awstub]

That's interesting. I use FSX Acceleration and the settings I'm using has me engaging the shuttle just like shown in the pictures and it launches just fine.

I'm pretty certain the settings I put in the cfg file are the ones I'm using on my system....but when I get home, I'll check it to make sure.

[DaveB]

This is FSX Stu. Anything can happen and often does!!:biggrin-new:

Here are the entries to compare. I kept the ones in the new cfg.. just commented them out.
//[TailHook]
//tailhook_length= 4.0
//cable_force_adjust= 1.2
//tailhook_position = -14.6, 0.0, -1.1
//[launch_assistance]
//launch_bar_pivot = 3.0, 0.0, -1.0
//launch_bar_lug = 3.0, 0.0, -1.0
[TailHook]
tailhook_length= 4.1
cable_force_adjust= 0.95
tailhook_position = -14.7, 0.0, -1.0
[launch_assistance]
launch_bar_pivot = 3.0, 0.0, -1.0
launch_bar_lug = 7.50, 0.0, -1.0

Not a great deal of difference as you can see. Launch bar pivot is the same but the launch bar lug is where it's at. I wish I could guarantee these were original but I honestly can't remember. I've not made them up that's for sure!!;)

EDIT: I found the culprit.. Mal:biggrin-new: In a previous install (which I kept).. the cfg is dated 3-2-13 ver 2.6 FDE Update. The last one Mal released is 12-27-14 ver 2.7 FDE Update. The launch bar lug values are different so if you've been using an earlier one Stu.. there's no reason to believe that they wouldn't be different again. Doesn't explain why you're seeing the launch position as in my shots not Butch's but there you go.
ATB
DaveB:)

[gray eagle]

Dave,

I tried to use the reply within your last and it would not take so I have to start another.
I applied your settings per your above. Do you think the shuttle and bridle look the same here as
in your picture? IMHO mine looks same as before I changed to your settings.

What's with the FDE updates you mentioned? Wonder if I am missing an update and how to get it?

My Mdl date is 10/25/2012

Edit: I have Virtavia A-4 Skyhawk v1_1.msi 5/13/2016

The thing of it is, I don't see a virtavia support page anymore. So I'd be hard pressed to get any updates if there were any to be had.

https://s16.postimg.org/pkf0axvmt/cat_shot1.jpg

[DaveB]

Hiya Butch:wavey:

I know what you mean. The forums have been acting up over the last 24hrs or so. Pages timing out and not loading.. replies to posts hanging. Didn't know if was just me or not.

Your screenshot shows how I WAS seeing it. My screenshot shows the bridle and shuttle much closer to where they should be. Now.. for the FD updates. They're on here but will probably take some finding. Mal released 2 sets. Airfiles and aircraft.cfgs for the 0-1 model and the same for the 2-3 model. Stu's 'all in one' repaint included a new aircraft.cfg with his repaints and SWS carrier extensions included but no airfile. For want of somewhere to start.. I took the airfile from the 0-1 Skyhawk and renamed it Virtavia_A-4E-F_Skyhawk.air to match his aircraft.cfg. I believe you went about things a slightly different way from what you've said so there's every chance we're all using a slightly different airfile/cfg combination.

I understand your confusion of it because it IS confusing. Mal wanted to give each loadout combination a unique airfile/cfg to match that particular loadout and this resulted in the Skyhawk spanning 22 individual folders:dizzy: These days of course.. a load manager would take care of this as they do on many of the newer models with great success.

Where does this leave us? Well.. I have my original install intact.. that is, the models I use (which doesn't span 22 individual folders). In addition, I have a new Skyhawk folder made IAW Stu's instructions for his 302 Skyhawk paint. This does double-up some of the models but this setup in no way interferes with the originals. Drawback.. all the loadouts will use the same airfile and aircraft.cfg so load weights aren't taken into consideration. You win some.. you lose some.

To save you time searching for Mal's latest files for the A4.. I've uploaded them for you:

Skyhawk01 (http://daveb.cbfsim.org/public/virt_A4_EF_Skyhawk_01.zip)

Skyhawk23 (http://daveb.cbfsim.org/public/virt_A4_EF_Skyhawk_23.zip)

Note: If you mind Mal.. please say and I'll remove them;)
ATB
DaveB:)

[gray eagle]

Hiya Butch:wavey:

I know what you mean. The forums have been acting up over the last 24hrs or so. Pages timing out and not loading.. replies to posts hanging. Didn't know if was just me or not.

Your screenshot shows how I WAS seeing it. My screenshot shows the bridle and shuttle much closer to where they should be. Now.. for the FD updates. They're on here but will probably take some finding. Mal released 2 sets. Airfiles and aircraft.cfgs for the 0-1 model and the same for the 2-3 model. Stu's 'all in one' repaint included a new aircraft.cfg with his repaints and SWS carrier extensions included but no airfile. For want of somewhere to start.. I took the airfile from the 0-1 Skyhawk and renamed it Virtavia_A-4E-F_Skyhawk.air to match his aircraft.cfg. I believe you went about things a slightly different way from what you've said so there's every chance we're all using a slightly different airfile/cfg combination.

I understand your confusion of it because it IS confusing. Mal wanted to give each loadout combination a unique airfile/cfg to match that particular loadout and this resulted in the Skyhawk spanning 22 individual folders:dizzy: These days of course.. a load manager would take care of this as they do on many of the newer models with great success.

Where does this leave us? Well.. I have my original install intact.. that is, the models I use (which doesn't span 22 individual folders). In addition, I have a new Skyhawk folder made IAW Stu's instructions for his 302 Skyhawk paint. This does double-up some of the models but this setup in no way interferes with the originals. Drawback.. all the loadouts will use the same airfile and aircraft.cfg so load weights aren't taken into consideration. You win some.. you lose some.

To save you time searching for Mal's latest files for the A4.. I've uploaded them for you:

Skyhawk01 (http://daveb.cbfsim.org/public/virt_A4_EF_Skyhawk_01.zip)

Skyhawk23 (http://daveb.cbfsim.org/public/virt_A4_EF_Skyhawk_23.zip)

Note: If you mind Mal.. please say and I'll remove them;)
ATB
DaveB:)

Fond this page http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php/89088-Virtavia-A-4-Skyhawk-Update-Read-on and did not know that this was going on.
Guess I was under a rock. Anyway two questions:

How do I apply those two attachments?
Is Mal still working on FDE's for all the various A4 configs - is that project done?
I was in middle of a PM to Mal when I noticed the attachmets you sent.

Thanks Dave.

[DaveB]

As far as I know, these are the only sets he released but there was no indication that these are the only ones he'll release. He has his finger in loads of projects so will probably come back and revisit the A4 at some point;)

What I would do (and what I DID do) is this. If you're still using the original setup (eg.. 22 separate aircraft folders).. backup the airfile in the 01 folder and use the new one in the zip. Backup your aircraft.cfg in the 01 folder (in case you have new paints added) then use the new 01 aircraft.cfg. You can then add any repaints to it from your backup cfg. Do the same with the 2-3 model. This is all we have until he returns with updates for the remaining models.. if in fact he does. At least you'll have the very latest FD's for the 0-1 and 2-3 models;)

ATB
DaveB:)

[gray eagle]

As far as I know, these are the only sets he released but there was no indication that these are the only ones he'll release. He has his finger in loads of projects so will probably come back and revisit the A4 at some point;)

What I would do (and what I DID do) is this. If you're still using the original setup (eg.. 22 separate aircraft folders).. backup the airfile in the 01 folder and use the new one in the zip. Backup your aircraft.cfg in the 01 folder (in case you have new paints added) then use the new 01 aircraft.cfg. You can then add any repaints to it from your backup cfg. Do the same with the 2-3 model. This is all we have until he returns with updates for the remaining models.. if in fact he does. At least you'll have the very latest FD's for the 0-1 and 2-3 models;)

ATB
DaveB:)

Okay, I checked the dates and the header for the 0-1 clean cfg file you attached and it is the same as what I have already installed. So I don't think you sent me anything newer then what I have.
I suspect the 2nd attach is the same. I read this on the header of the aircraft.cfg I already have installed. // A-4E/F Skyhawk Flight Dynamics Ver 1.0 by mal - CLEAN Aircraft
It's the same name and file size and date.
The air file is Virtavia_A-4E-F_Skyhawk_0-1.air Jan 2015. So same-o same-0
which brings me back to that A4 cat hookup in you photo where your nose bridle is a lot closer to the shuttle then mine. Hummmmm....


I just discovered this page http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php/89088-Virtavia-A-4-Skyhawk-Update-Read-on

guess I've been under a rock or something and just noticed it today. :pop4:

[DaveB]

Yup.. these threads are hot as rocks for a while then sometimes die and come back to life later!! You have to be in the right place at the right time!!

The FD's talked about in that thread are the ones I posted.. v2.7. It's quite possible that the original uploads at vendors were updated to take the new airfiles and cfgs into account. If the final line on the update list shows v2.7 FDE Update.. you already have the latest files.

Do your tailhook and launch assistance entries read like this:

[TailHook]
tailhook_length= 4.1
cable_force_adjust= 0.95
tailhook_position = -14.7, 0.0, -1.0
[launch_assistance]
launch_bar_pivot = 3.0, 0.0, -1.0
launch_bar_lug = 7.50, 0.0, -1.0

Just look at the 0-1 model;)

Also.. did you use ANY of Stu's aircraft.cfg.. eg, at least the SWS carrier extensions entry at the bottom?

I'm gonna be off to my sack in short order due to having to be up in 6hrs for work so I may not pick this up until tomorrow.
ATB
DaveB:)

[gray eagle]

Yup.. these threads are hot as rocks for a while then sometimes die and come back to life later!! You have to be in the right place at the right time!!

The FD's talked about in that thread are the ones I posted.. v2.7. It's quite possible that the original uploads at vendors were updated to take the new airfiles and cfgs into account. If the final line on the update list shows v2.7 FDE Update.. you already have the latest files.

Do your tailhook and launch assistance entries read like this:

[TailHook]
tailhook_length= 4.1
cable_force_adjust= 0.95
tailhook_position = -14.7, 0.0, -1.0
[launch_assistance]
launch_bar_pivot = 3.0, 0.0, -1.0
launch_bar_lug = 7.50, 0.0, -1.0
Just look at the 0-1 model;)

Also.. did you use ANY of Stu's aircraft.cfg.. eg, at least the SWS carrier extensions entry at the bottom?

I'm gonna be off to my sack in short order due to having to be up in 6hrs for work so I may not pick this up until tomorrow.
ATB
DaveB:)

Here is the original entries // out

//[TailHook]
//tailhook_length= 4.0
//cable_force_adjust= 1.2
//tailhook_position = -14.6, 0.0, -1.1
//[launch_assistance]
//launch_bar_pivot = 3.0, 0.0, -1.0
//launch_bar_lug = 7.0, 0.0, -1.0


I used what you posted ^
[TailHook]
tailhook_length= 4.1
cable_force_adjust= 0.95
tailhook_position = -14.7, 0.0, -1.0
[launch_assistance]
launch_bar_pivot = 3.0, 0.0, -1.0
launch_bar_lug = 7.50, 0.0, -1.0 <<<<<<< Maybe a different variable would bring the lug closer to the shuttle?


Update List? Oh wait a minute, the header info on the aircraft.cfg?

// A-4E/F Skyhawk Flight Dynamics Ver 1.0 by mal - CLEAN Aircraft
// 4-22-2012
// 5-17-2012 ver.1.1
// 5-20-2012 ver.1.2
// 5-29-2012 ver.1.3
// 6-05-2012 ver.1.4
// 6-08-2012 ver.1.5 Near Completed Flight Model
// 6-16-2012 ver.1.6 New Models added to Cfg.
// 6-18-2012 ver.1.7
// 6-21-2012 ver.1.8 G models added
// 6-27-2012 ver.1.9 Cleaned up descriptions & misc. items
// 6-29-2012 ver.1.9 Clean Aircraft CFG.
// 7-31-2012 ver.2.0 FD Completed
// 9-11-2012 ver.2.1 Flight testing completed - remembering 9-11
// 21 Oct 2012 ver.2.2 : new lts sect, fuel dump & exh fx, AP bank, wingfld/tailhk, thumb UI.
// 11-29-2012 ver.2.3 Updated lateral stability, COG, yaw moi. h-tail incidence, launch bar lug
// 12-04-2012 ver.2.4 adjusted h-tail incidence, decreased flap lift & pitch, lowered fuel gain, reduced elevator effectiveness, reduced pitch stability, decreased oswald efficiency, modified (404) stall characteristics, lowered vert. inertia, lowered elevator control factor.
// 12-06-2012 ver.2.5 increased yaw stab2
// 12-07-2012 ver.2.6 decreased aileron & rudder effectiveness, increased yaw stab 1 & 2
// 1-06-2013 ver.2.6 out for testing
// 1-08-2013 ver.2.6 test results positive
// 1-22-2013 ver.2.6 ver.2.6 fine tuned - 2.6 release candidate
// 1-30-2013 ver.2.6 decreased yaw stability, increased aileron response, increased elevator response
// 3-2-2013 ver.2.6 FDE updated


;***** clean A-4E *****

[awstub]

I just checked my cfg and it matches the one I included with the repaints......and uses the stock launch assistance settings.

Looking at the JPEG instructional I included, I see that when I circled the air file, I put the line from it to step 3 when it should have gone to step 2 which can lead to some confusion.

I was so tired at the time, I was almost delirious.....but I really wanted to get it kicked out the door and forgot to double-check it..... sorry about that.

[gray eagle]

Here ya go Butch.

Drive her up and just over the shuttle:
http://daveb.cbfsim.org/public/shuttle1.jpg

shift+i and she only moves a little forward.. pretty much where she should be I reckon:
http://daveb.cbfsim.org/public/shuttle2.jpg

Launches every time with her original launchassistance entry reinstated. Still.. as I said above, if the settings in Stu's aircraft.cfg work ok for you.. I'd not bother changing them. I've not touched the carrier extensions entry btw;)
ATB
DaveB:)



Dave,

So what can I do to get that shuttle to look like your does? You can see that in my pics it looks like that knuckle that the wire is wrapped around it far forward of the shuttle, wheras the wire
should be attached to the front edge on the main shuttle. How did you manage to make yours look better?
No reply from Mal on those FDE updates.

As an aside, I can hook up a F4B on the shuttle and it looks a lot better. Gotta be some thing in the aircraft MDL/FDE or something.

[DaveB]

Hello mate..

Yup the F4B hooks up just fine as it always has. I'm trying to fathom a way to pass what I have to you in a way that will work with the minimum of fuss. When you added Stu's paints, did you add them to each individual (read corresponding) model? This would have meant new entries in model folders with E clean 1, E USMC 3, E2 USMC2, E2 USMC1, E clean 2, E Navy 1 and E2 Navy 2. Mind boggling:dizzy:

When I know how you have the paints currently installed, I can form a plan of attack;)

EDIT: I note that the decks are clear in your shots. Did you set the deck as clear or have you not added the carrer extensions entry to the aircraft.cfg?
ATB
DaveB:)

[PhantomTweak]

Dave,

So what can I do to get that shuttle to look like your does? You can see that in my pics it looks like that knuckle that the wire is wrapped around it far forward of the shuttle, wheras the wire
should be attached to the front edge on the main shuttle. How did you manage to make yours look better?
No reply from Mal on those FDE updates.

As an aside, I can hook up a F4B on the shuttle and it looks a lot better. Gotta be some thing in the aircraft MDL/FDE or something.

First off, you can try reducing the longitudinal setting in the [launch_assistance] line launch_bar_lug = 7.50, 0.0, -1.0. The first number after the =sign. Drop it down a few tenths, save the aircraft.cfg file, and reload the plane. That MAY get your positioning right. Or at least change it one way or t'other. If it does, you can then adjust it accordingly.

As to why the Phantom looks better: In planes made for FSX, the launch bar info, tail hook too, is built into the MDL file. If you add the launch assist and tailhook sections to your aircraft.cfg, however they will over-ride the settings in the MDL file. Generally, the launch assist settings are pretty accurate to most set-ups, but the tailhook section generally needs a little fine tuning. Or isn't in the MDL file at all.

Also, the Contact point for the nose gear's longitudinal setting will affect where the launch bar lug shows up, or attaches to the boat anyway, since it's attached to the nose gear.

Finally, and I am not certain about this, but I've always done it, when you pull up to the cat for launch, you're supposed to hit SHFT+U, THEN SHFT+I, however this plane seems to be working for you, you all said, without that step. I don't know if this could be having an effect or not. I'm thinking that perhaps the boat's able to grab the lug without you dropping it somehow, thus making it off longitudinally, since when the launch bar comes down it is farther forward than when it's up.

Just my thoughts on this, however few and limited they are...
Pat☺

[gray eagle]

Hello mate..

Yup the F4B hooks up just fine as it always has. I'm trying to fathom a way to pass what I have to you in a way that will work with the minimum of fuss. When you added Stu's paints, did you add them to each individual (read corresponding) model? This would have meant new entries in model folders with E clean 1, E USMC 3, E2 USMC2, E2 USMC1, E clean 2, E Navy 1 and E2 Navy 2. Mind boggling:dizzy:

When I know how you have the paints currently installed, I can form a plan of attack;)

EDIT: I note that the decks are clear in your shots. Did you set the deck as clear or have you not added the carrer extensions entry to the aircraft.cfg?
ATB
DaveB:)

Okay let me comment on those questions:

I watch my son install the textures to those models affected. He commented that the installation photo was a bit confusing but later Stu did a correction comment on that.
Here are the folders that Sts paints are in:

Virtavia A-4 Skyhawk 0-1 Clean
Virtavia A-4 Skyhawk 4-7 Wing Tanks
Virtavia A-4 Skyhawk 8 WT,Snakeye,Shrike
Virtavia A-4 Skyhawk 14 BT,MK82,LAU-3A
Virtavia A-4 Skyhawk 15 BT,M117,MK82
Virtavia A-4 Skyhawk 16 WT,MK82,LAU-3A
Virtavia A-4 Skyhawk 17 WT,Walleye,LAU-10 Zuni
Virtavia A-4 Skyhawk 19 BT, MK 117,LAU-10 Zunis
Virtavia A-4 Skyhawk 21 WT,MK 82 Snakeye,LAU-3A
Virtavia A-4 Skyhawk 23 'F' Wing Tanks
Virtavia A-4E_F_Skyhawk

The carrier extension entry was only added to the clean version and no others. I figured that I would just do carrier ops in the clean version (for now).
I was only offered one Corral sea in AI Carriers so that is the one I chose.

[gray eagle]

First off, you can try reducing the longitudinal setting in the [launch_assistance] line launch_bar_lug = 7.50, 0.0, -1.0. The first number after the =sign. Drop it down a few tenths, save the aircraft.cfg file, and reload the plane. That MAY get your positioning right. Or at least change it one way or t'other. If it does, you can then adjust it accordingly.

As to why the Phantom looks better: In planes made for FSX, the launch bar info, tail hook too, is built into the MDL file. If you add the launch assist and tailhook sections to your aircraft.cfg, however they will over-ride the settings in the MDL file. Generally, the launch assist settings are pretty accurate to most set-ups, but the tailhook section generally needs a little fine tuning. Or isn't in the MDL file at all.

Also, the Contact point for the nose gear's longitudinal setting will affect where the launch bar lug shows up, or attaches to the boat anyway, since it's attached to the nose gear.

Finally, and I am not certain about this, but I've always done it, when you pull up to the cat for launch, you're supposed to hit SHFT+U, THEN SHFT+I, however this plane seems to be working for you, you all said, without that step. I don't know if this could be having an effect or not. I'm thinking that perhaps the boat's able to grab the lug without you dropping it somehow, thus making it off longitudinally, since when the launch bar comes down it is farther forward than when it's up.

Just my thoughts on this, however few and limited they are...
Pat☺



SHIFT + U (Launchbar) is for those aircraft like the A-7 that have a bar thats attached to the nose gear. The A4 didn't have/use one. They had those tension or hold back bars that would snap
when a certain amout of tension would break or snap the bar and the aircraft would break free of the catapult - that is what the A-4 uses, seen a lot of em tossed over the side after the planes
launched.

I tried your recommend settings and nothing changed.

https://www.patriotspoint.org/news-and-events/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/shuttlehookup.jpg

http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l261/SpazSinbad/SkyhawkTensionCatapult.jpg


http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l261/SpazSinbad/GeneralA4catapultArrangements.jpg

[DaveB]

Rgr that mate;)

Yup.. aware that shift+u isn't necessary with the Skyhawk.. its force of habit I'm afraid.. something I do without thinking:encouragement: It can be left out but it does no harm. OK.. I'll knock something up for you to try. It's probably something really simple;)
ATB
DaveB:)

[DaveB]

Ok Butch..

I've checked the files I'm using and have modified them for you to test (eg, taken out all the other paints so that you don't get P3D screaming that there are duplicates!!):encouragement:

Here's what to do..

In the 0-1 folder.. rename your aircraft.cfg and air file to aircraft1.cfg and add a 1 to the airfile so that it won't be read. Unzip the contents of the folder I'm sending and add the contents (my aircraft.cfg and airfile) to the 0-1 folder. You'll only see the Coral Sea Skyhawk clean in the sim and none of the other paints that live in that folder but don't worry. This is just a test and if it works (which it should) we can set about adding all your other clean 0-1 repaints.

If you've added the carrier extensions to the panel.cfg.. you can call it up by using shift+3. If you haven't and are unsure, just shout and I'll send you my panel.cfg. You will only ever see ONE entry in AICarriers for Coral Sea. You change the deck config yourself using the shift+3 panel. This isn't like the Enterprise or Nimitz.

I've not flown the clean model since Stu posted the 302 paints but I've checked it and it works exactly as the wing-tank version. Drive her up to the shuttle and park the nose wheel just ahead as in my shots. Parking brake, shift+i and it should pull forward just a little and show the bridle attached and ready to go;)

Oops.. nearly forgot. Here are the files testfiles (http://daveb.cbfsim.org/public/files4butch.zip)

That's it fella. Any snags.. just shout.
ATB
DaveB:)

[gray eagle]

Dave

Thanks- those files fix the catapult conundrum. So what's next, what do we do now?

https://s12.postimg.org/ssg3aoym5/perfect.jpg

[DaveB]

That's great Butch:encouragement:

Where to go next indeed. The original setup doesn't lend itself to 'easy' no matter what you do. Did you say you'd only added this paint to the clean model (0-1)? If so.. I have a plan whereby your original install (pre 302 paint) gets restored and I'll send you my 'all in one' setup for this paint. Stu plans to do a couple more for it so it'll be easier in the long run if we go down the all-in-one route. Your original install will remain intact and the all-in-one will happily sit beside it without interference;)

ATB
DaveB:)

[awstub]

A search of the web has gotten me pictures of eight different VF-153 A-4C/E Skyhawks and two of the humpback F model (one of which is already included in the set I just made).
Since I have eight of the C/E model I'll do them all, se we can have two flights of four. I'd like to find another two of the F model, so we can have four unique paints of it as well.
DaveB has graciously agreed to help me with this, so I think we'll end up with a nice pack of VA-153 Skyhawks in the very near future.

Stu


That's great Butch:encouragement:

Where to go next indeed. The original setup doesn't lend itself to 'easy' no matter what you do. Did you say you'd only added this paint to the clean model (0-1)? If so.. I have a plan whereby your original install (pre 302 paint) gets restored and I'll send you my 'all in one' setup for this paint. Stu plans to do a couple more for it so it'll be easier in the long run if we go down the all-in-one route. Your original install will remain intact and the all-in-one will happily sit beside it without interference;)

ATB
DaveB:)

[DaveB]

A search of the web has gotten me pictures of eight different VF-153 A-4C/E Skyhawks and two of the humpback F model (one of which is already included in the set I just made).
Since I have eight of the C/E model I'll do them all, se we can have two flights of four. I'd like to find another two of the F model, so we can have four unique paints of it as well.
DaveB has graciously agreed to help me with this, so I think we'll end up with a nice pack of VA-153 Skyhawks in the very near future.

Stu

Nice one Stu:encouragement:

Butch..
Can you revert your Skyhawk back to pre-302 setup (hoping that you only converted the 0-1 model). This will mean removing the cfg and airfile I sent.. removing the 302 entries from your existing cfg and removing the 302 paints from the 0-1 folder. If you can do that.. I have a file ready for you to download. Can't post it here so will send a link via PM.

ATB
DaveB:)

[gray eagle]

A search of the web has gotten me pictures of eight different VF-153 A-4C/E Skyhawks and two of the humpback F model (one of which is already included in the set I just made).
Since I have eight of the C/E model I'll do them all, se we can have two flights of four. I'd like to find another two of the F model, so we can have four unique paints of it as well.
DaveB has graciously agreed to help me with this, so I think we'll end up with a nice pack of VA-153 Skyhawks in the very near future.

Stu

Wow! That sounds great looking forward to the paints. :encouragement:

Thanks. :untroubled:

[gray eagle]

Nice one Stu:encouragement:

Butch..
Can you revert your Skyhawk back to pre-302 setup (hoping that you only converted the 0-1 model). This will mean removing the cfg and airfile I sent.. removing the 302 entries from your existing cfg and removing the 302 paints from the 0-1 folder. If you can do that.. I have a file ready for you to download. Can't post it here so will send a link via PM.

ATB
DaveB:)

Dave,

The only folder I messed with (converted) was the Skyhawk clean 0-1 folder, changed out the files you sent with the ones that were originally there.
I don't follow on the revert to pre-302 setup but I did only mess with the clean 0-1 folder. The livery called for in the original clean 0-1 cfg file is:
***** clean A-4E *****

[fltsim.0]
title=A-4E/F Skyhawk 0
sim=Virtavia_A-4E-F_Skyhawk
model=E_clean_1
panel=
sound=
texture=E_NAVY_1 <<<<< E-Navy-1
kb_checklists=
kb_reference=
atc_heavy= 0
atc_parking_types= mil_combat
atc_airline = Navy
atc_flight_number=AG303
atc_id=149993
atc_id_color= 0000000000
ui_manufacturer= Douglas
ui_type= A-4 Skyhawk
ui_variation=A-4E USN - Clean
ui_typerole=Military Jet
ui_createdby=Virtavia
ui_thumbnailfile=texture.thumbs/Thumb_Skyhawk_0.jpg


They sure put this package together in a strange fashion. Now a days for multiple arm configuration you can do it like Milviz did it with their F4 just drag the weapon over to the belly of the plane.
Wish it was that easy for me when I was loading F-4's during carrier ops off coast of Nam.

[DaveB]

OK fella.. I've sent a PM with the All-in-one setup ready for you to use. Just make sure you remove the files I sent, put yours back and delete any reference to the VA-153 paints from your original config.

ATB
DaveB:)

[gray eagle]

OK fella.. I've sent a PM with the All-in-one setup ready for you to use. Just make sure you remove the files I sent, put yours back and delete any reference to the VA-153 paints from your original config.

ATB
DaveB:)

When you say put yours back, which one are those? Original files.....:dizzy:

That zip file you sent me I take it that those files are removed?

Who's on first what's on second and I don't know is on third :dizzy:

My head hurts, think I will give this a break for now.

[DaveB]

When you say put yours back, which one are those? Original files.....:dizzy:

That zip file you sent me I take it that those files are removed?

Who's on first what's on second and I don't know is on third :dizzy:

My head hurts, think I will give this a break for now.

OK mate. When I say put your files back.. I mean take the files out that I sent you yesterday for the test (aircraft.cfg and airfile) and bin them. That will leave you with the renamed airfile and aircraft.cfg you started with. Rename them so they're active. Remove any reference to the VA-153 paints you had in your aircraft.cfg and delete the VA-153 texture textures from the 0_1 folder.

Open the zip file I sent and drop the entire folder (Virtavia A-4E_F_Skyhawk) into your Simobjects/Airplanes folder.

What you SHOULD end up with is all your Skyhawk folders PLUS the new Virtavia A-4E_F_Skyhawk folder sitting below them.

Think of it this way. Put your Virtavia A-4 Skyhawk 0-1 Clean back to how it was before you ever heard of the VA-153 repaint.. bin the paint and remove any reference to it in the aircraft.cfg.

The alternative is too complicated to even contemplate. This really IS the easy way.
ATB
DaveB:)

[gray eagle]

OK mate. When I say put your files back.. I mean take the files out that I sent you yesterday for the test (aircraft.cfg and airfile) and bin them. That will leave you with the renamed airfile and aircraft.cfg you started with. Rename them so they're active. Remove any reference to the VA-153 paints you had in your aircraft.cfg and delete the VA-153 texture textures from the 0_1 folder.

Open the zip file I sent and drop the entire folder (Virtavia A-4E_F_Skyhawk) into your Simobjects/Airplanes folder.

What you SHOULD end up with is all your Skyhawk folders PLUS the new Virtavia A-4E_F_Skyhawk folder sitting below them.

Think of it this way. Put your Virtavia A-4 Skyhawk 0-1 Clean back to how it was before you ever heard of the VA-153 repaint.. bin the paint and remove any reference to it in the aircraft.cfg.

The alternative is too complicated to even contemplate. This really IS the easy way.
ATB
DaveB:)

I don't have that renamed airfile and aircraft.cfg - right now, I don't have any in there (0-1 Clean folder). I added that Virtavia_A-4E_F_SkyhawkGE.zip to the A4 folder, it is at the bottom of all the other A4 files.
So what do I use for an Aircraft.cfg and .air file for the first 0-1 clean folder?

[awstub]

You should be able to leave your old Skyhawk installation untouched.

All you really have to do is copy the needed files and folders from it into the folder with the repaints.

Yes, it takes up more room on your hard drive this way, because you are duplicating dada...
..but it makes things much simpler than trying to re-do the stock Skyhawk folder.

Stu

[DaveB]

Hopefully.. we've crossed this bridge. I've sent Butch new aircraft.cfg and airfiles for his 0-1 folder (latest versions with no trace of VM-153) so that's done. Re where you've put the files I sent Butch..

The zip file is called Virtavia_A-4E_F_SkyhawkGE.zip and the folder inside it doesn't have the GE suffix. Take the entire folder from inside the zip and drop it into your Airplanes folder.. JUST your airplanes folder. Treat it as a completely new model. ;)

ATB
DaveB:)